Beyond the Event: A Youth Ministry Podcast
Bringing together influential voices from the CIY community to walk alongside you in your journey to maintain momentum between the mountaintop experiences of youth ministry.
Beyond the Event: A Youth Ministry Podcast
BTE4.12 Are We Ready for Gen Alpha? with Josh Celestin and Korey Klein
Mailbag questions or topic suggestions? Text us!
Get ready to explore the vibrant world of youth ministry with a special lens on Gen Alpha. Join us as we welcome the Emmy Award-winning preteen pastor Josh Celestin and CIY Director of SuperStart Korey Klein to unpack some extraordinary moments from this SuperStart tour. Listen as we detail the dedication of our ministry teams who balance the demands of full-time work while passionately energizing preteens for their spiritual journeys.
Our conversation uncovers the unique characteristics of Gen Alpha, a generation raised in the digital age, with insights from Josh's diverse journey from videography to ministry. We tackle the challenges and opportunities of growing up with instant digital access, and consider how AI and technology shape Gen Alpha's understanding of truth.
Finally, we discuss how the church community can empower preteens, giving them leadership roles and responsibilities that foster confidence and spiritual growth. Through personal anecdotes and the introduction of resources like the "Start Strong" devotional, our episode underscores the importance of meeting Gen Alpha where they are, while encouraging them to develop lasting commitments to faith and service. Don't miss our exploration of these critical topics, and a look ahead to our next episode where we address mental health with guest Jordan Francis.
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- Email us at podcast@ciy.com
Hi, I'm Brad Warren. This is Beyond the Event Youth Ministry Podcast presented by Christ in Youth, where we help you maintain momentum between the mountaintops. So glad that you're here. Today we're going to talk about some young people who we lovingly refer to as Gen Alpha.
Speaker 1:We're going to be talking about them with Josh Celestin. He is the preteen pastor at First Baptist Church in Orlando, florida. He's a great dude. You probably not probably but you may have seen him up on stage hosting at one of our Superstar events over the course of the past couple of years. He does a really, really good job at talking to these students and I think you'll see and learn and hear that he does a really great job of talking about these students in a way that honors Jesus and the ways that Jesus is at work in the next generation. But before we talk to Josh, I'm joined by Corey Klein. Hi, corey, I did talk a little bit there, sorry to say. Jim Alpha, right after you said it Harshen my vibe. You're welcome, corey. We're about halfway through a Superstart tour. We are. We're recording this. This is not going to be released until early March, but recording this Valentine's Day yeah, valentine's Day weekend.
Speaker 2:Happy Valentine's Day, corey. Happy Valentine day weekend. Happy, happy Valentine's day. Happy Valentine's day to you too.
Speaker 1:Sorry, I didn't bring any like candy or it's okay, you are sweet enough, um my heart Anyway. So we don't have any events this weekend. Get a little break, um not trying to make preteen pastors compete with, uh, their marriages to go to Super Start. So, anyway, how's the tour going? How are things?
Speaker 2:It's been really good.
Speaker 2:And I'm not trying to sound like a broken record, because I feel like every year you have me on here and I'm talking about how's the tour going. I say, brad, this is the best year ever. The theme is just amazing. What we're talking about, the scripture, proverbs 4.23. I'm going to say it again it's amazing.
Speaker 2:This really is one of those years and I think what's enhanced it more than anything and what I've heard back is just the teaching's been incredible, talking about what it truly looks like to guard not your physical heart but your soul, to guard your heart, to guard your soul. Guard who you are as a human because it determines the course of your life. Guard who you are as a human because it determines the course of your life. And so I've seen fourth through sixth graders come to these different events and leave these events ready to share the gospel with their friends, and I've seen them come out of it, be like you know what, the things I take in every day. Maybe some of that it's not so great for me and I don't want that in my life anymore and I want to be. I think the biggest thing is I want to be shaping others to look more like Jesus. So we've heard those kinds of stories and it's been really cool.
Speaker 1:I have not gotten to go to a superstar yet, but I'm going to go to a couple. I think, when this one.
Speaker 2:When this airs, you'll be at a superstar or you're just be getting back. I'll just be Nebraska, yeah.
Speaker 1:I'll just be Nebraska. Yeah, I will have just gotten back. Yeah, cause we released them on Mondays. So, that's right. I'll be between my two superstar events.
Speaker 2:Could you talk about what you think your brand had just done in the Nebraska and like how that was?
Speaker 1:Well, here's what I'll tell you. Nebraska was awesome. Yeah, it really went super well. Um, I would say that, um, we had some trouble with our audio engineer, but besides that, you know, pretty smooth event, yeah, what were the troubles with the audio engineer. He's just lazy he just doesn't work hard. You know just kidding, it's Michael and he works super hard. I love him.
Speaker 4:I'd like to point out that the record date of this episode is February 13th, which is two weeks before the Nebraska event, right? So if you're speaking prophetic words, I'll be pretty upset by the time. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know who to blame this on?
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're going to have a great time. It's going super fun. Stonebridge um going to stonebridge some of my favorite people christy peepermeyer I need to have her you should have her on the podcast, actually should write it down.
Speaker 1:Um, okay, anyway, we're gonna talk about what's already happened, though a little bit. Yeah, um, we're, we're, we're underway here. I want to hear I'm gonna be honest, we're on a little bit, yeah, um, we're, we're, we're underway here. I want to hear we're I'm I'm going to be honest, we're on a little bit of a time crunch you're good so I want to hear one story, okay, really quickly.
Speaker 2:This was a few weeks ago in houston, texas. You know this story. Um, there is their church, they brought the met, they brought third graders, they were allowed to come to super start and so, which is not Not normal, but some come and that's totally fine, and so they were invited.
Speaker 2:So there was a friend at the church who was a preteen, a fifth grade boy, who invited that third grader to come to Superstart with him. Does not go to church, his family doesn't go to church. That friend, who was in third grade, came to Superstart. At the end of it he was called by our host. Zach was talking about, hey, even the simplest things of kingdom work is maybe you're on first base saying Jesus loves you. Maybe you're saying, hey, jesus loves you.
Speaker 2:So that third grader left Superstar that weekend. Later that night, went back to his grandparents who he stays with on the weekends, who are not involved in the church except for in the church in 10 plus years, said, hey, I would love to go back to the church. I was just at tomorrow. Will you come with me? Well, grandparents came with him to church that next morning, got connected. Grandpa got connected with a coworker he works with who's been involved in church. So now they're a part of that small group and they're like, hey, we're going to come back. They went to service and through all that, the grandpa in the lobby. I got to meet him briefly because I was hanging out that next day had a little guy named Gary the Potato in his front shirt pocket and if you don't know you'll see him. Gary the Potato is a part of our tour. He's silly, he's funny, a part of AMPA.
Speaker 2:But what's really cool is, even in the funny, silly moments of Superstar it shows just like preteens can be silly and funny, what they are capable of, which is doing amazing, big things even in the small ways. And so that preteen invited a third grader. That third grader invited his grandparents to church and now they're plugged in in a church in the community. And that's what Christ in you is all about. That's what superstars it's all about. It's getting you plugged in to know Jesus and be part of community. And that's my one story. If you want to hear more, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I could stories, and rad knows that he's probably like oh, so many stories, cory. Yeah, we're totally gonna record that later. Um, that's incredible, though. I mean preteens have no fear, which is great. Yeah, they're just like yeah, I'll do that. Um, they're great kingdom workers they really are, and I love that story and, um man, you just never know the far reaching impact that some little thing like that could have. That's really incredible stuff.
Speaker 1:So, that is one of many, many wonderful stories that have already come out of tour. Only a third of our events have happened as of the recording of this podcast, and so we're looking forward with anticipation that God is going to continue to do many, many more of those things throughout the remainder of our events, and we're excited about that, but in the meantime, we are going to do the mailbag.
Speaker 2:Here's the mail that never fails.
Speaker 1:It makes me want to wag my tail Every time.
Speaker 4:When it comes.
Speaker 1:I want to wail, michael. Oh, that was nice, cory, yeah remix.
Speaker 4:Um, you know. So, speaking of nebraska, speaking of blues, clues, yes, really quick.
Speaker 1:No, no, no steve burns pops up on my for you page sometimes. Oh really, he's a very intense person.
Speaker 3:Really.
Speaker 1:Yes, he's become very intense. In a good way or a bad way, in a weird way. Okay, it's TikTok, right, yeah, but he's like hey, how you feeling.
Speaker 4:Like that kind of intense. It's because he knows his audience. It's the. It's his audience, is it? It's the same audience as when he was on blues clues.
Speaker 1:That's true, yeah, but draw things with crayons. I don't like that's what I want. Okay, yeah, bring a dog around.
Speaker 4:I don't care, I'm just kidding what I want.
Speaker 1:Okay, bring a dog around.
Speaker 4:I don't care, I'm just kidding Speaking of Nebraska Okay. I believe at the beginning of February we had Matt Stevens on. We did and we talked a decent amount about how, just how Nebraska is as a place to live.
Speaker 1:I feel like we spent a significant amount of time on their tourism website.
Speaker 4:Yes, we did. What is their?
Speaker 1:motto Nebraska, it's not for everybody.
Speaker 4:We have a statement, not a question from. Seth Bates just saying Nebraska is a great place to live. Period.
Speaker 2:All of it All Nebraska.
Speaker 1:Thanks for writing into the mailbag set yeah, thank you, seth listen. I said on that podcast there are things about nebraska that I love the zoo, the wings I brought up the zoo this is amazing.
Speaker 4:I've not been, but it's, it's been on my list.
Speaker 2:You should go yeah, um.
Speaker 4:Okay, we have a question from matt barry. Thank you, matt, um this question. I want to ask this question because, uh, we were just talking about stories. Um, cory, of all the people on our staff, I think is one of the most active people telling, like bringing stories back to our staff from events and trying to present to our events. So matt has this question um, what are the best ways for us to tell the stories and wins that we had at CIY events and post about it?
Speaker 2:you'll share it in every meeting and you'll maybe make a video about it, but I honestly I don't know how your setup of your Sunday mornings are there. But here's the thing you know your rhythm, Matt, and what you guys get to do every year as you go to events and you take your students in the summer to camps. I would just be like, whatever that meeting looks like with your lead pastor and with your church leadership, be like, hey, it'd be awesome to have, whether that's the Sunday after or later in the summer, just having a Sunday where we could celebrate the stories of what God did, whether that's having those few students who come up and they share about it and they share their testimonies, or if it is via video, but on the other side too, I mean, it could be honestly as easy as an email the following week, like on a Monday. Be like, hey, parents, hey leadership, here's three quick, four quick things that your students got to experience because of what Jesus did to them and through them, at Move or at Mix or whatever it is, and so I've seen people do that and that's been a win.
Speaker 2:I see it happen in preteen ministry where after even a normal week on a Sunday, they get just an update on Monday. Hey, parents, here's what your students learned about today. Here's how you can have conversations, and so I think that would be my two things Whether, maybe, that you find a Sunday where it's just like hey's highlight what jesus is doing in student ministry and what he did this summer. Or, yeah, just honestly, as simple as an email, because people still check emails, right, brad, yeah, the some yeah, do you guys check emails?
Speaker 1:I do, I do. Yeah, my little red dot, fairly small right now, only seven unread emails, good job. Um, what about you? Yeah, I, I know a lot of churches that are doing like the ciy celebration event, um, which I just think is a really cool thing. Um, I know, like creekside christian church in in st john's, florida. Um, my, my home church, the church that I was baptized.
Speaker 1:Shout out, shout out, um eli birchfield's, a youth pastor there, a really incredible dude and they do like a worship night after. You can do something like that where you like, play all the songs that your students love from CIY and have a few students stand up and share their testimonies and invite parents to that. Even, um, I think, any like. When I, when I read this question, um, one of the things that I think would just immediately rose to the to the forefront of my mind is yeah, a youth pastor can tell parents stories and that's awesome. But how do we create situations where, like, students are comfortable telling their parents um story of what happened? Because so often kids get on from move and they're exhausted and they get in the backseat of the car and their dad's like how was move and they're like is good, I'll tell you about it later and then you know we never actually circle back around to that. Um, anyway, it's a really great question.
Speaker 2:That is a really great question yeah, I mean yeah, and that could be a video form too. It's just like hey, let's just sit them down. It could either be, it could be on your iphone. It's like you just film it and you just share it.
Speaker 1:Email is great too, though yeah, like hey, here from move oh yeah hey, uh, last night was night one. Here's what we talked about. Yeah, during the week.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great point while it's still fresh on your mind yeah, cool stuff. Yeah, matt, thank you so much wow thanks matt thanks matt.
Speaker 4:Thank you, michael, for that too. Yeah, of course. Yeah, um, we also have a question for our friend, casey lanier. Um, I I like this question because we're in the middle of Super Start season and Super Start is a unique rhythm compared to our other event season in the summer, where we are working our full-time jobs during the week and then we go on the road for the weekend and then we come back for another full week at work.
Speaker 4:Casey is asking what keeps you saying yes to showing up for kids and teenagers every week, especially when you're worn out.
Speaker 1:Jesus, yeah, that's like that's.
Speaker 2:Jesus is true? I think it's, and I know we'll have a conversation here with Josh Moore about Gen Alpha here in a moment. But I think it's With who, josh, not Josh Moore. No Moore here in a moment. Oh, josh Moore here in a moment. Sorry, josh, celestin Moore.
Speaker 3:We'll have Moore here in a moment. Sorry, I yes.
Speaker 2:No, his name's not Josh Moore. That's not my bad. We'll have a conversation with Josh in a moment but really, for me personally, it's the fact of just like their eagerness to be ready and to know about Jesus. And me personally too I have two kids who are in Genelfa. One, my daughter, just turned four, and I'm thinking about man. She's going to be a 10 year old so soon, and so I'm thinking about these kids who truly, like I was, like I want my daughter to know Jesus and love Jesus with all her heart, and I want these students to do it too. And even though I'm really tired, this is what matters. This is forever work. I don't know about you.
Speaker 1:I mean it's kind of a cop-out answer, it's kind of a Jesus juke. It's kind of a Jesus juke, go for it. But I mean the Holy Spirit is the only thing that can and does sustain me through the summers. Like it's, it's, it's there. There's no other way for me to explain it I may. Chronically Michael is is a good friend of mine, he can tell you this a chronically tired person, like even in just my normal life. I'm like oh, I worked eight hours today. I need a nap. This is crazy. So like for me to go to events and be able to like get five hours of sleep a night and have all these very good but very intense conversations and I get.
Speaker 1:I get any cookout. I get to the end of the summer and I'm like how did I survive that? The only answer is the Holy Spirit. That's all I got.
Speaker 2:No, that's not wrong, it's great.
Speaker 4:That's true.
Speaker 1:I know, but it feels like I'm I don't know, no the Holy Spirit wins. Holy Spirit wins. All right, you brought up Josh Moore. Let's go talk to Josh Moore, josh Moore boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom boom.
Speaker 2:Josh, josh Celestin, josh Celestin, alright, let's go. Boom boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom boom boom ever to be on this podcast.
Speaker 1:who has won an Emmy? And I want to know this. It's on screen.
Speaker 2:So people watching on YouTube are like why?
Speaker 1:does that guy have an Emmy?
Speaker 3:Is it?
Speaker 1:fake.
Speaker 3:Is it? Is it fake? It's not fake. It is not fake. Can you grab it?
Speaker 1:real quick. Can you give us a little? Can you give us a closeup?
Speaker 3:I want to know why you have that. Well, um, so it was actually prior to being in preteen ministry. Uh, I was a videographer, so I still am, I do freelance videography and, um, I got to work on a project, uh, with a team of uh of other people and I was just a cinematographer on the project. My dude, sean uh, fellow visuals does a great job with all that stuff and I was just a cinematographer on the project my dude, sean uh, fellow visuals does a great job with all that stuff and basically it was a story about this girl that had down syndrome. Down syndrome it was basically overcoming that and we got to tell her story a little bit and I was one of the cinematographers on there. So that's what I want that for is for cinematography.
Speaker 1:That's the coolest thing I've ever heard. Isn't that amazing? I am in the presence of greatness. What?
Speaker 3:was the name of the project. Um the name of the project I gotta get.
Speaker 1:I didn't mean, I didn't mean to stop you. I really didn't mean to stop you.
Speaker 3:Oh wait, wait, it's probably patricia's show, pat.
Speaker 1:Patricia's show. Yes, okay, I'm going to check that out. Can I stream it anywhere?
Speaker 3:Absolutely, you'd be able to stream it. I'll send you a link. I think I'll send you a link. Okay, I'll send you a link.
Speaker 1:That's really cool, okay, well, now we're going to move on to our conversation with Emmy Award winning preteen pastor Josh Ellison.
Speaker 2:I don't think that's how you pronounce his last name.
Speaker 1:How do you pronounce your?
Speaker 3:last name, celestin.
Speaker 4:You're fine, celestin how did they say it when they announced that you won the Emmy?
Speaker 2:Celestin, that's so good.
Speaker 1:Adele Dazeem. Okay, um, wow, god really gotta shake off. The I'm starstruck is truly what's happening. Yeah, um, okay. So gen alpha gen alpha are people who were born. Um, we actually have another generation now, a gen gen beta, which we're not going to talk about because they are a little tiny babies. Uh, gen alpha people born basically starting in 2010.
Speaker 1:Um, so every buddy who is in uh, both preteen and junior high ministry right now is is part of this cohort called gen alpha. There's, like no research about them yet because they're all tiny people. Actually, that's a lie. I have a group of ninth grade guys that I hang out with and they're all taller than me. You know, really, I mean, it doesn't take a lot, but it's kind of crazy. So, gen alpha, all right. So I want to know, josh, what your experience has been with this generation of people, understanding that, like not, I mean, we know that not every generation is like a monolith. Not every single one of these people are are the same. But uh just kind of wanted to have a uh, an open discussion with you about what you're experiencing with this generation of young people as compared to uh, maybe the ones that we were interacting with uh several years ago. So I'm curious just high level, and then we can dig in and kind of get into the nitty gritty. What are some of your observations about these young people that you are pastoring today?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think, like you said, I think I am in a specific area and a specific context, so some things may look a little bit different, but I think overall, I think Genoffa is still curious. I think Jenoffa is still curious. I think there are curious individuals and like they are always seeking and looking for different information. I think they are plugged into. It's like this weird wrestle of like they're plugged into internet more but like some of them still on the cusp where parents don't want to kind of give them access yet, so like they're in that weird space but like they are not supposed to have social media but they probably do have it and can access it through somebody else's phone, but don't have a phone to access it through right like um.
Speaker 3:So I think they are ex, they're extremely curious, they are definitely internet savvy and I think just just the amount of information I think we talk about all the time where it's just like man these, uh, this current gen alpha are like when they're navigating fourth and fifth grade. It's almost like me back then navigating eighth grade. Like the stuff that they're exposed to, the stuff that they see, it's just coming at them faster. So I think those are kind of the three things that kind of stand out to me when I kind of think about uh gen alpha and just like the uh uh at the differences between them and the other kind of generation. I think just the amount of information that they're seeing is just you can't compare it well, that is terrifying, yeah, uh.
Speaker 1:so let's, let's go ahead and and peel back some layers of that and then maybe, uh, when I understand more, it won't be quite as scary, because I mean, yeah, I mean, I see, what you see, which is a generation of people that can know anything in a split second. It's like, yeah, they can be an expert on anything, um, in a very short amount of time by pulling their phone out of their pocket or grabbing their friends say they're digital natives.
Speaker 2:Now you know, that's a machine.
Speaker 1:That's who they are. Yeah, that's so weird. Like that expression is weird because I think of myself as being, like, a technologically fairly savvy person.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I did still have to like, learn. Like we had dial-up internet right when I was a kid. I don't feel like an old man, but at the same time it's like I had to wait for my mom to get off the phone with her sister in order to be able to get on aol instant messenger and like that's just a different like. These kids have grown up with every piece of information in the universe at their fingertips.
Speaker 2:It's instant information. And also, josh, I'm curious, as you were talking about, you know, maybe they don't have a phone, but they have a friend with a phone or a digital device, whatever, but now they're in a world too. You know, you've heard the last few years, let's talk about AI, where now digital natives, they're used to like surrounded by a world of AI. So have you seen that in a way, I don't know, affect your ministry? Have there been preteens, fourth graders, as they're a part of your ministry? Because, like, hey, what is the truth, what's not true? Are they wrestling with things like that too, because of the world of AI and what we're surrounded by, good or bad?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think I haven't seen the full bleed of AI and the usage of it, but I think for context. This past Sunday I was leading a fourth grade boys group and one of the questions I asked the kid was like hey, man, what do you like to do for fun? What is something that you're doing that you just feel like you're good at? He said well, I'm learning JavaScript. That's computer programming dude. Like yeah, like oh, okay, like you're gonna completely lap me in a few years, like it's just like they're. Like like uh, brad was saying, it's just like man, they're um. Access to information, their tech savviness, it's just like they're growing up with it. Ipads are second nature to them. Touchscreen doesn't mean anything. That's like that was novel to us, but it's not novel to them. They're in it and they're just living it and breathing it. Man.
Speaker 1:So I'm like I don't this is such a funny conversation because everything I think about saying I'm like I'm going to sound so old. I'm just going to sound like an old curmudgeon who's like well, back in my day we knew how to. Well, whatever, um, we're just gonna have the conversation and and that's gonna be that. How old are you, josh?
Speaker 3:I am 33 okay okay, sick, all right.
Speaker 1:So we're all, we're on the same page here, we're like we're, we're vibing, okay, yeah. So, um, it concerns me from a faith perspective, like for the perspective of a student who is is gonna engage with with god and follow jesus um, that I feel like students are losing the ability to like intellectually wrestle with things because, everything just like has an answer.
Speaker 1:It's like there is no. It feels like there's becoming less and less and less and less gray area. Uh, because of that ability to google, something is like oh well, you know what's the what is this? What is this? What does this mean? What is it? You know those types of things and I do feel like the christian faith is lived in gray areas. So I don't know what my question is, but I think it might just be like how do we teach kids who feel like they have access to all of this information to ask good questions and to think deeply about things and not just to take something at its face value? Do you know what I mean? Does that make any sense?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that's, I think's, I think it's, it's a um. I forgot what I said. I think any sammy says it's a tension to be um managed, not a problem to be solved. I think it's such a tough like balance to that because I think, like you said, there is, I see it two ways. I see it like even from a standpoint of just like and I'm curious to see what cory might see on on this also but like I see it from the standpoint of of like there is AI and there is all of these things where you can go and get these answers immediately and that in itself could become a crutch because, like you said, the logic, the reasoning, especially preteens at this age. Right, that's what they're, they love to do, they love the question, they love to try to figure out, and I can see how that can handicap that. At the same time, I can see how, um, with the uh, with ai and just some of the other things, being able to limit or shorten some of the um minute things and get straight to the information, I think it can help excel them to understand something.
Speaker 3:So I I think it's a, I think it's a double-edged sword, but I think it's. I think it's it's person to person man. I think it it starts there and I think face-to-face is always going to be a thing. And I think, um, I think with pre-teens, what I like to do is just, uh, challenge them, because they want to be challenged and they want more responsibility. So it's kind of putting forth that challenge in front of them of like, hey, man, how are you going to navigate? How are you going to navigate this, how are you going to access this? And you get the choice to kind of decide what your life is going to look like. But yeah, I think it's the face-to-face, it's the intentional conversations. I feel like it happens one-on-one for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree, josh. From my perspective, what I've seen and what I've heard talking to children's pastors, and even our conversations and I over the last couple years, I feel like because AI is so opposite and like it's technical and it is instant gratification in a sense of like what, what answers are going to get back and whatnot. But what's so beautiful about scriptures and about the gospel is that it is also instant. But also it's a journey and I feel like what I've heard from children's pastors is kids in gen alpha whether that's a journey. And I feel like what I've heard from children's pastors is kids in Gen Alpha whether that's a fourth grader up to like seventh, eighth grade they're actually more open to it because when they hear the gospel they're not just wanting to believe it but they also think it's a good thing.
Speaker 2:Man, this is a good thing for me, and so I think there's beauty in the pace and walking with Jesus and that you can look through scripture and Jesus has always been consistent and always been there. I feel like Gen Alpha, from what I'm seeing. Again, this is new territory we're still figuring out and we're going to be figuring out for a long time. Is they want to walk that pace because it is different? It's not what they're used to, but it's kind of beautiful, and so I feel like those are conversations I've been having. I don't know, josh, for you, you know you've been doing this for about four years now in preteen ministry. Have you felt that like when you're teaching on Sunday or Wednesday? Have you felt that, as you're asking deep questions, knowing that it is different and they're coming from you know where a lot of their learning came, post pandemic as well?
Speaker 3:Like, what's that been like? Yeah, I think if they're. If they're a lot of times, if they are one of the most nerve wracking things. What I like to do within our large group spaces. I am very call and response. So I'm very like, hey man, like just shout it out. It's very free, flowing or whatever. So like at times at the end of our Bible message we'll listen to something and I'll be like, hey man, do y'all have any questions? And they will shoot out some outlandish questions. So it's just like I think it speaks to again. It speaks to their curiosity and their knowing. But a lot of times also, some of the times, they know the answer to the question already. They're just trying to hear my perspective on it. Right, they've already been exposed to it, they've already seen something else to it, they already know the direction they want to go, but they want to hear what I'm going to say about it. So it's very interesting yeah.
Speaker 2:Is it also for you, like in your ministry and what you guys are doing there in Orlando, do you feel like in that space you're like? I know I hear people like giving their students like space to fail in a sense, like to ask questions? Do you feel like it? Does that happen a lot, where they feel that openness to ask questions, even if they're not ashamed or afraid, even if they think it's right? You know we're just talking about with AI and whatnot Like do they have that back and forth when they're like oh, maybe you're right about that and whatnot like do they have that?
Speaker 3:back and forth when they're like oh, maybe you're right about that A hundred percent. I think one of the things we try to key in on is like, hey, man, this is a space and that we want y'all to experiment and figure out and ask those questions, right? I think, a lot of times when I think for me, speaking for myself, I grew up in church, I grew up in a French speaking Baptist church, but my faith didn't actually become my own until I graduated high school and made a decision for myself. I was just doing it for my, because my parents were doing it and it just it was what it was, but that wasn't until I was in high school. So I think, giving them a space to, I think I think there are four things that they kind of think about primarily. I think they think about friends, I think they think about their choices, I think they think about conflict and I think they think about bullying. I think they're experiencing that at a high level.
Speaker 1:And I think, giving them chances to navigate. Say those four things again, sorry.
Speaker 3:Nope, that's fine. Friends, choices, bullying and conflict Okay, I think those are the things that are like primarily what they're wrestling with. So giving them spaces to fail at that on a Sunday morning. We try to provide that space and I think they do feel safe. They're starting to feel safe enough to talk about those things and knowing that those things have consequences when you do them wrong, and I will enforce the consequence. But when you come back next Sunday, I still love you, like my love has not left for you. That's what Jesus does for us, right? So I think that's the kind of environment that we would like to and in preteen at first orlando, that's the kind of environment that we're trying to cultivate okay, I want to talk about three things.
Speaker 1:I want to make sure that we hit on three things, and I'm going to let cory pick which one.
Speaker 3:We talk about first okay, great I want to talk about what choose? Your own adventure choose your own adventure, choose your own adventure.
Speaker 2:Corey.
Speaker 1:Here we go Gen alpha. I want to talk about attention span. I want to talk about emotional vulnerability and I want to talk about kingdom work.
Speaker 2:Let's just go in that order. Let's go in that order. You want to go in that order. I love that.
Speaker 1:Let's go in that order. Right there, you have seen a uh, a diminished ability to, like, focus over long periods of times or to engage in conversation, um, over the course of, you know, several minutes or even an hour, um, and just kind of like what that experience has has been like for you, or if it's maybe like rebounded and gone the other way. I have no idea.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, no, I think it continues to get shorter. I think, um, trying to speak, uh, speak a live message on Sunday I try to be at like eight minutes, maybe nine minutes, and even within that, it's like every two minutes. I'm trying to call a response, I'm trying to break it up, I'm trying to. Okay, now let's look at the slide. It's just like it's it's finding continuous ways to like re-engage them. You gotta think about I was actually. I saw something and it was like a gen alpha. Actually, the top social media platforms for them was. This is where I felt old. It was Tik TOK, it was Snapchat and then it was Instagram, and then I was just like oh, so Instagram is like Facebook now. Like I thought I was, I thought I was up on it.
Speaker 1:And Facebook is like a print copy of the washington post. So that's where we're at now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah a hundred percent. So just in knowing that and knowing on tiktok, like it's your, uh, the algorithm, algorithm is just like, curated perfectly and like you're scrolling and scrolling, and scrolling and scrolling all these micro videos. So it's just like, yeah, I think attention spans, I would. I would fast as you want it. You can scroll as fast as you want.
Speaker 1:You can hold down on videos and they'll play faster. You can like you can get whatever amount of information in whatever timeframe you want. But then there's also like a flip side of it, where tick tock continues to allow videos to be made that are longer and longer form. Like I think you can make a tick toK video that's like five minutes long or something. Now, um, which is weird, like that, that almost feels like it's moving in the other direction to me, but it's interesting to hear you say like no, my experience has been like I need to keep it under eight minutes and I need to keep things moving and I need to keep them engaged. What are some of the things that you do like from stage in a large group, setting, um, to change the vibe? Maybe they don't, maybe maybe it's not actually changing, but you're kind of like taking them on a little journey in order to kind of keep them engaged. What are some of your little just tricks and tips that you kind of do to keep them focused?
Speaker 3:No, that's good, I think, for me. So, uh, background, I actually used to do Christian hip hop for a little bit and, um, my, uh, uh, my rapping performing skills kind of come out in that. So I think, uh, I say that to say sound dynamics with your voice. So like I will start high energy but then I will bring it down and like I'll do this thing where it's just like if they're talking and I'm in the midst of saying something, I would just like stop talking and just wait.
Speaker 3:Like I won't even, I will wait till I get all their attention back and then I'll come back on it. So it's just like I feel like, like you said, it's a storytelling within the message that you're doing and bringing them on a journey. I think, oh, I think they love stories. Like they, like they love stories you tell a story and they are engaged and they lock in because I think their brains also are starting to try to reason from, like K through third their Bible stories and like they know all of that. So even when I'm telling it, they could finish the story for me. But now their brains are trying to like reason to, okay, this is the story, but like, what is the life application in my life? And I think they're starting to reason and wrestle with that.
Speaker 3:So, um, so, yeah, so I think just, uh, being able to be loud, be energetic, be calm, being able to tell a good story, as you're kind of bringing the texture or scripture to life and, yeah, and I think, engaging them. So I like to do some things where it's just like, even if it's something as simple as we're about to read this verse, okay, I need three volunteers. Y'all are going to read the verses when we're up on here, so y'all got to stand right here when I tell you read, it's going to be right there, you're going to read it and it's just breaking it up in different ways to try to do this. Those are just some of the things that we've seen work for us. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, I'm going to move on unless you have something.
Speaker 2:No, I loved it. No, we're good.
Speaker 3:My attention on a tour, cory on a tour, like superstar. Yeah, yeah, attention spans. How does that influence?
Speaker 1:hey, how did? Yeah, we asked the questions here I was being curious I'm sorry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, you're good no, honestly, man.
Speaker 4:Oh, were you gonna say something? Yeah, before we move on, um, you're not. You don't have have a Grammy for a hip hop.
Speaker 1:You're the closest person to an EGOT that I know, Can you get a Tony for superstar? All right. Anyway, I have a question, Corey how does the attention span stuff play into how you interact with students at Superstar and how we program that?
Speaker 2:So I'll be very honest with you. It plays a big factor, especially pre-COVID. You would hear different studies say every year of your age is another minute of attention span you have. So when we work with a 10-year-old at Superstar, this is pre-COVID You're like, oh, you got 10 minutes of their attention. And I agree with you, josh, it's way less than that, especially now. I think you have half of that, okay, and I think you're totally right. So it's something we do.
Speaker 2:If you've ever been to a superstar, you'll see it, josh, brad Michael is, when you come and you hang out, almost every two to three minutes, even in the teaching, something is changing, whether that's you're talking about Samson's life and you're throwing spaghetti on someone's head, or then you're spinning like, hey, now that you have spaghetti on your head, can you read this verse up here? Oh, now, actually in the audience, everyone get on your feet and we're going to help Gary the potato get through this adventure. Like there's things always changing, and so I completely agree with you, josh, but I think that attention span is way, way less I agree with that, especially post-COVID than ever before. I don't even know a number, but we used to say, you know, yeah, if you're 10 years old, you got 10 minutes. I think it's half of that, I think it's half of that.
Speaker 1:The easy way to program is well, we're going to worship and then a message, and then have a video and then do worship again. It takes a lot more work to be a little bit more Catholic about it. It's like stand up, sit down, stand up, fight, fight, fight whatever and kind of get them moving around and shifting and changing different things back and forth. You know, but that is more likely to like keep them engaged over a long period of time. Is there value in like? Is church a place where we can try to coach students to have longer attention spans, or should we just like meet them where they're at? This is what it is, you know, you're?
Speaker 1:yeah, you know. Do you understand my question, or is that I understand?
Speaker 2:I don't know I don't think it's silly, josh I. I don't know what you guys do there. Orlando, I know if you look, look at different preteen ministries. I know growing up, when I was in sixth grade too, what my at the time junior high pastor did really well and it still works great with especially 11, 12-year-olds I see a lot is they don't mind things being longer when you give them ownership of something or leadership in something, when you're training them?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'm curious. That's what I've seen Brad, josh for you talking about. Yeah, does the church train and help them have long attention spans? I've seen it worked and it's been beneficial for students when they're like well, I'm a part of this, I'm taking ownership of this and I get to help younger kids know about Jesus, or I get to use my gifts, talents and abilities to let people know about Jesus.
Speaker 1:I'm just concerned that we're heading to a world where, like the NBA, has a 10 second shot clock and TV shows are six minutes long. You know what I mean. Or it's like are these people going to eventually figure?
Speaker 2:out Right, and so are you like. Are we as a church? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't know, Are we going to conform to that? Is that more what you're saying? Are we just going to? Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3:That's a good. That's a good thought, brad. I think I think about that too. I think at times I just like to play out the future and sometimes the question I engaging kids like this, like in their kids, like as adults what is that going to look like? Like, what? Like? How does? What are the bleeds of that? What are the how does? How does that practically look? I don't know, like I really don't know, and I think I think to your question about how we can do we try to influence it, do we try to coach them, I think it's. I think it's tough. I think it's tough because we have them, for if it's 40 Sundays in a year, that's 40 hours Like we had and and and doing everything else at a super fast pace everywhere else.
Speaker 3:So it's just like it is. It's just, it's just a tough thing to kind of manage on that and I don't, yeah, I it's, it's tough man.
Speaker 1:It's tough. No, totally All right. Um, um, what were the other two things? Emotional uh, I also have a short attention span. Um, here we are. Uh, yeah, emotional intelligence so this is a totally a point of curiosity from my own experience.
Speaker 1:I have talked ad nauseum on this podcast about the group of ninth grade hooligans that I hang out with a couple of times a week at Christ Church of Oronogo. They're insane people and I love them. They have no emotional intelligence, absolutely none, and I don't know why that is. I don't know if it's specific to this group of people. I don't know if it's a ninth grade boy thing or eighth grade boy thing. I don't know if it's a gen alpha thing. What I know is, if you try to get them to talk about how they feel about anything, it is like you are trying to ford the pacific ocean and it's just impossible. So I want to know if I'm alone in that and maybe I am and that's fine or if that's also something you've noticed, and how, like a pretty emotionally charged gospel can relate to people like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think the question I hear you asking is how emotionally intelligent, how aware are pre-teenage and alpha of their feelings? Is that what I hear you asking, Like how aware?
Speaker 4:are they.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I think we actually just came off a series where we were journaling a little bit and I think one of the things that I saw actually to set this up and to tell a quick story. So when I came into pre-teen ministry I was doing videography before Pastor Heath, who's a kids pastor at First Orlando, kind of tapped me. Basically was the one that kind of recruited me and brought me in. At first I was like man, I don't want to do that. And then I was like let me go sit with the kids. I want to go sit with the kids. And I was just like, oh, I understand y'all, like I get where you're at.
Speaker 3:And here's why I understood them. It's because they had a natural like vulnerability to themselves that like it they didn't, but they weren't aware of it. Like preteens they'll snitch, they'll snitch on their parents, they'll snitch on what they're. Just they just talk and they don't know, they're not aware of what it is, but like they're in that innocence of just like, oh, like this is what I'm navigating or this is what I'm feeling or this is what, whatever.
Speaker 3:So, to fast forward a little bit, we, a few weeks ago, we had a series and we were journaling after the series and one of the kids I was talking to him and I was just like man, like how do you, um, what's the hardest part about sharing your feelings with others? And he's just like man. Sometimes I just I just don't know how to put words to it, right, I just don't know what it is so like. I think that, uh, I think, naturally, what I've seen in my experience is that they, they can tend to be vulnerable, they can tend to be aware, but they're not, um, they're not aware that they're actually aware, they're just operating out of, just like this. This is what I know, and I think some of that actually gets quelched when they start going into middle school and high school, because you start seeing people and this is how you behave and this is how you behave, so then they lose it even more. So I think it's something for sure one has to continue to cultivate within them.
Speaker 1:But I think, yeah, there seems to be this natural, just yeah, willing to say whatever, maybe that is what I'm experiencing a little bit is that these guys are in middle school and going into high school and I don't think it's cool for them to have feelings. I really don't. I don't think it's like if they were to be like, yeah, I'm sad in front of their friends, like I think the expectations that they put on themselves is like I'm supposed to be fun and that is the most valuable thing that I can be to my friend group, and to be sad is not to be fun, or to be scared is not to be fun. You know what I mean. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:And honestly, I was going to say too it's like a couple of years ago we got the spin. Josh, you're part of this. You brought preteens to it. We were at your church, we talked through emotions with Gen Alpha, and we use this phrase of when you feel an emotion, when you feel sad, when you feel anger, when you feel happy, whatever it is to pause and remember that Jesus felt it too. Actually, Brad's looking through that book right now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, actually, brad's looking through that book right now. Yeah, man, that thing was clutch man, I think. In just the giving the emotions and then giving the definition for what that is, I think it's super duper helpful because they just don't, like I said, they don't have language. Me as an adult, I found a book and it talked about emotions. I had to go through and like, oh this, give me words. My wife makes for me all the time when I'm just like man, I'm not feeling right, should go read your book.
Speaker 3:Just go read, go figure out what you're feeling because I don't want to deal with it right now, like go figure it out yeah like even as an adult, like I'm wrestling through that.
Speaker 1:So but like this, this book finding god in every feeling, or we called it our feelings journal. I think colloquially, um was like one of the most well-received things that ciy has ever created. I think, yeah, um, in my seven years on staff here, that, uh, that particular program I think resonated with with preteen pastors more than just about any other program that we've done. Um, and I think a huge part of the reason is because they saw their students talk about their emotions for the literal first time. Yeah, like that they had not, that they had not been able to like engage in this way. And I'm so grateful for this book and actually I had kind of forgotten that it existed until we were having this conversation. I remembered that it was on the shelf behind me and uh, yeah, part of me wants to hand this to my ninth grade guys and be like tell me, tell me what you're feeling well, I'll say this, josh, you mentioned about read a book, right, you're saying this.
Speaker 2:I, I know personally. I've literally used that book on days when I'm feeling sad, like I'm not kidding, when I'm just like trying to wrestle with things. It's, you know, as we're talking about gen alpha, it's like we're all wrestling through something. So, yeah, you're ninth grade boys, gen alpha. It's like, hey, let's sit down, let's talk about these fears that we have, let's talk about this anger we're dealing with, or talk about the fact that we're not even talking about our emotions at all.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, and think about feelings. Feelings dictate how you deal with your friends, it dictates how you deal with choices, it dictates how you deal with conflict and it dictates how you deal with bullying.
Speaker 3:So it's just like man if that's one of the major things that I have to wrestle through and I don't know how to wrestle that, how are my friendships going to be great? How do I navigate dealing with bullying when I don't even want to accept the fact that I actually feel sad because I don't want to feel sad, because I don't want to feel weak and I don't want to like. It's all intertwined.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Let's talk about bullying a little bit. I think that's an interesting one. Part of the reason that I think it's interesting is because it is timeless. Um, I also worried about bullying when I was in junior high. In high school, um, like, what do you? What are they thinking about bullying?
Speaker 3:um, so at the end of, I think, year two, year one or year two, I was doing this and, um, there's this kid. I brought kids up. Like I said, I'm pretty spontaneous sometimes, so I brought some kids up, it was the end of the school year and I asked them hey, um, what is something that you wish you knew at the beginning of fifth grade? That's what I asked my fifth graders. It was the end of the year what is something that you wish you knew at the beginning of fifth grade? And fourth grade was something that you wish you knew at the beginning of fourth grade. And I'm asking you this question because I want to give these questions slash answers to the people that are coming up. And I brought this one kid on stage and said something cool. Brought this other girl on stage, said something. I brought this one kid on stage and he says I wish I knew that Ralphie the bully would bully me all year and that just messed me up.
Speaker 3:And I think and just realizing, like man, how are we equipping preteens Gen Alpha, how are? That is prominent only because, now, I say only because I think part of the reason because is everyone's trying to find their place in footing. So, like Jaffa is still in a place where it's like it's cool to be you and like what you like, but you're about to enter middle school where you're going to be judged and made fun of for if you don't like what you like and bullying is just like, it is a, it's just a foundation for that to grow within that. So, like, how do you? How do you start having those conversations? How do you start?
Speaker 3:Like I said, I think it starts with identifying being more aware of emotions and how one is feeling and where boundaries lie, being more aware of emotions and how one is feeling and where boundaries lie. I think it starts with we actually created a devotional talking about bullying and having those conversations and parents having those conversations with their kids. Because I think oftentimes some parents I feel like are hesitant to even talk about bullying because they feel like if they talk about it then it means it's going to happen to them. But, like the kids are probably have navigated some form of it and just don't know what to do, like they just kind of shut down on that.
Speaker 1:Makes me sad, like how have we not figured this out? Yeah, it's been a thing for such a long time. Yeah, you know you were homeschooled.
Speaker 2:You don't understand. I mean I was. I bullied myself, so you know.
Speaker 1:Michael also is homeschooled, but he had 11 siblings. You're not wrong, though, but it is true, I go add more people in his homeschool than I had in my public high school, so that's just a fun fact.
Speaker 2:And I really, as I joke about it, I'm curious to, as we talk about, yes, being bullied by others. I like how you put it. It's just like you come in, whether in, whether you're in fourth, fifth grade, but then you're going to middle school, junior high and it's like cool. You have your own opinions on this, but also here's our opinion. That's never changed. But I do feel like, as I was joking, but it's true, I think more and more students are really bullying their own selves.
Speaker 3:They're really bullying themselves even just as much.
Speaker 2:Now I don't know if that makes sense or not, but with the things and the lies we talk about in our heads, what? I don't know if that makes sense or not, but with the things and the lies we talk about in our heads, what Satan is throwing our way, you know, I don't know. Have you seen that? I know I have, maybe at the church I serve at like, I've seen students in sixth grade and it's just lies in their own head and it's not what people are doing, but they're lying, you know, letting the lies come to their own head and they're living that out and it's almost like they're letting themselves be bullied.
Speaker 3:100, I think it's. It's the. I think some of the foundation of that is the, the need to fit in, the want to fit in right. They want to fit in, they want to be with their peers, they want to be with their crowd. I got a girl that plays flag football.
Speaker 3:I'm saying, hey, girl, lean into that man, play that flag football like do what you do like it may not be common, but like you enjoy it, get out there, go, do what you do, like I think. Yeah, I think it's the. I've just navigated, especially as we try to help. Um, uh, I think we did a great job at our church trying to figure out how we could create some type of promotion strategy to help the transition part of it. And, and still, even with that, one of the hardest things is like when there's probably a handful of kids that will not go into student programming just because it's just like it is too over, they're just not getting it, it's too overwhelming, or they don't feel like they've found a place for friends or they. They feel like they'll be, but like it's just it's a lot. So it's such a it's such a sensitive thing to navigate yeah, for sure yeah, all right, last one do you remember this one?
Speaker 1:kingdom work, okay, um, cory, stop bullying me, sorry read the book.
Speaker 2:Read the book, it's okay.
Speaker 1:So I'm just curious. It's always funny to me, like, when I reflect on my own time in junior high and high school, thinking about the ways that I like served in my church. Many of them are obsolete now. Like you can't do some of the things that I did, for, like I remember our worship pastor would send me, like, the list of songs that we were going to sing on Sunday and I had to type out the slides in PowerPoint. For, like, that was something that I offered to do it was PowerPoint, microsoft PowerPoint and so like.
Speaker 1:There would be misspelled words up on the screen or whatever, and I would just be hiding my face in the back of the room because, you know, I didn't know how to spell righteousness.
Speaker 1:Anyway, all that to say, I'm curious, as we, as we have this conversation about increased technology and awareness and intelligence and access to information and AI and how kids seem to be like growing up faster and kind of all of the different things that we've hit on in this conversation what service in the church looks like to this generation of young people? Because I know it's important to you, josh, it's something that's super important to CIY. It's it's missional for us to find ways for um, for students, who are created in the image of God, to to find their kingdom work, the good works that he's prepared in advance for them to do. So, uh, yeah, I'm just curious if if you've kind of noticed anything with that, or if there are unique service opportunities, especially that you feel like are available to this generation of people that might not have been available to young brad who didn't know how to spell righteous young brad, it's that middle e they're really always it always r-i-g-h-t-e-O-U-S.
Speaker 1:It shouldn't be there. It was weird.
Speaker 3:It'll throw you for a loop? Yeah, no, I think for us that's something that we've been curious about and trying to take more next steps in. I think, just for context coming in, I was probably like the first real official kind of preteen pastor for the area, so we've been trying to develop certain things and move it to the aspect of the serving aspect and I think I think some of the things I feel like by and far just Gen Alpha. I think that they are willing and want to serve. I think what they want right now is responsibility. Primary thing they want is responsibility Give me. I want to be able to do this on my own. I want to be able to do this on my own. I want to be able to do this on my own. I want to be able to do this on my own. I want to be able to do this on my own, god forbid. They're good at it, actually and and like just get out of my way, kind of thing. So I think they are so primed for wanting to do things and finding ways where they can do something and have a impact in that Right, and I think it's so important, like you were talking about, I think it's so important for them to step into that and have opportunities for that, because that's what Jesus did Right and we're showing them. Man, it's not about just coming here on a Sunday morning and hearing and playing games and all of those things, but like it's living it out also.
Speaker 3:So I think some of the things practically that we've explored so far is just like some of the. We don't really have a ton of them because we have our own kind of preteen space and we have our own large group, our own small group, so we don't have them actually participating, doing like tech things and enduring service or whatever. We try to push them to that. But one of the things, one of. So I'm on the kids team also and we're just an extension of that, and one of the one of my teammates on the kid team actually started, uh, this thing called kids jam and melissa and basically they got an opportunity to basically kind of do like it's kids worship kind of thing and they kind of get to go up there and lead and I think it's cool because I think when they get to go back and, um, when they're back in the space that they used to be in and like they're the older kids now it does something for their confidence, right like it, it automatically boosts their confidence and I think, like for me.
Speaker 3:I remember when I was in I think it was like in eighth grade and I I don't, I don't know how it happened I, I really think we, we thwarted I'm pretty sure my teachers thwarted the votes, but I won like vice president of my class, right, and it should have never happened. But like for whatever reason, that gave me Uber amount of confidence to be like, yeah, no, well, I did that, so I can do something else Right, and I can do more. So how much more? When we started equipping them to do things and they start to feel the pride of those things. Well, they want to grow up and do more of that for God and do more kingdom work. So I think, I think it's a crucial part of that strategy.
Speaker 1:And how like incredible that the church gets to be the place where they have confidence. Cause we were just talking about how they go to middle school and high school and that is like beat out of them, you, you. Middle school is about conformity, so much.
Speaker 1:It is the place where kids, personalities go to die, and it just makes me so sad, truly, and the fact that you're talking about giving them spaces and pushing them to do things that may not come super comfortably to them, but they give them a lot of confidence. It's like, yes, let's make the church the place where you can come and just be yourself. That's so cool. I love that. I don't know what do you think, corey?
Speaker 2:No, I love it too. I love it and I was just curious. Bouncing off of that, josh, I know some of your story you talked about. You shared with me growing up in the church, going through being a preteen, being in middle school, being through high school and going through hoops and whatnot. Now you are serving with preteen ministry. That is your full. You're devoted to that right. That's your life's calling.
Speaker 2:In this season, this is kind of a two part, going off of what we were talking about with kingdom work. God's using your kingdom work to expand and help fourth and fifth graders know their calling in life to serve the kingdom and do it in the church, like Brad has mentioned. What was that like? Why preteen ministry for you? What was that like to get to that spot?
Speaker 2:Because I'm also curious, because I feel like there's probably people listening or watching right now who don't know a whole lot about this age group fourth and fifth grade. They might be like man. They smell weird or man. I don't know how to deal with them. Are they in third grade? Are they second grade? No, like these are people, as you mentioned, who are ready to take on next steps. You are ready to own whatever that is, whether it's their faith or responsibility. And so could you just speak really just about why you're doing what you do today, like what that calling was like in your life, and maybe, hopefully, that just speaks to those listening now? Maybe there's someone right now listening to your voice who feels like calling from God to be like maybe I should be a part of this work, maybe that's their kingdom. Work is to help fourth through sixth grade know more about Jesus.
Speaker 3:That's good. That's good, yeah, I think, yeah, I got a shout out. Like I said, he got a shout out, he, he, um, I think it started with being recruited, someone seeing something in me, right. So I think, um, that's where it started because, like I said, when he first mentioned it, I was just like, yeah, man, he's like you should pray about it. I was like, great, like I'll pray about it and, like you know, sometimes you have those conversations and people don't come back around. He came back around the next week and said, did you pray about it? I said that I did not. I'm not gonna let me go actually pray about it. I said that I did not, let me go actually pray about it.
Speaker 3:And I think, what, what happened when I actually got up there and saw the preteens? I think what connected for me was I had an opportunity to be able to do a lot of work with, like college and young adults and like a lot of what I was seeing there was before doing preteen and a lot of what I was seeing there was just like man, the mistakes have already happened, the the it's, the brokenness is already there and we're trying to restore so that we can go on, and I thought what was so compelling about preteens was, like man, it's preventative work, like it's like where we get them in a place where they actually still want to be influenced Right, like they still want to be influenced right. Like they like they'll come up and they'll be friends with whoever it is that they see. They just want to connect, they want to relate and like they're still able to be shaped no pun intended, um, and so I think it's just, it's such a I think that was super compelling to me and I think also, if I'm just being honest, I think I relate to kind of their plight, a little bit of like feeling overlooked or wrestling with like, um, can I just be myself and all of those things Right, and it's just like I, I as I start to navigate and overcome those things, I'm just like man.
Speaker 3:I doubled down on that and just like, yeah, no, be you please. Like be like fully you, who God created you to be. So I think I think it's a little bit of that. I think it's a little bit of that side of things and a little bit of the side of just like man. I resonate with what they're navigating through at this current stage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's awesome we got to wrap up here in a minute but I do want to ask you you are a preteen pastor, a role that not a ton of churches honestly have Somebody just dedicated to overseeing kind of this in-between elementary and middle school kind of age group that we love to minister to at Superstart.
Speaker 1:So a lot of the listeners of this podcast are student pastors. They're people who oversee middle and high school ministries. So they where you have kind of been living in this Gen Alpha world for a while. They either are more new to it, um, if there's somebody who's kind of living in the junior high world or, uh, high, many high schoolers most high schoolers are still, uh, gen Z, um, and we've got kind of this divide, this shift, um, that is coming up. So I'm curious what you would hope for student pastors like as they're receiving some of the students that are kind of graduating out of your ministry, what you would hope that they kind of take, take that baton and and run with when it comes to how to interact with these students, how to lead these students, how to love these students. Well, you know all of these types of things.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, no, that's good, I would say, as we're wrapping into closing Brad. That's good, I would say, um, as we're wrapping in the closing Brad. Thank you for having me. Corey, mike, I appreciate all y'all for just even having this conversation on Gen Alpha because, like I said, even talking about how sometimes it could feel like it is, uh, just over gloss, it's just in this weird. They're not teenagers yet, but they are preteens and it's just this weird awkward phase. So I appreciate y'all having that conversation and and just even the team of people that helped me do it Cause it's not just me, it's a ton of volunteers and it's another staff member, dana, and just everybody that did that Just super grateful for that.
Speaker 3:I think, for um, student pastors listening to this, I think all I can say is get ready. I think, just being like being prepped for, like, hey, man, what worked before may not work, it may not work. You may have to. The playbook can, can stay intact, but, like the plays, some plays may have to change. Like it's, it's, it's a different crop of kids and I think, I think, if we are and we stay curious with that, I think, I think that's the posture that I would encourage is just a posture of curiosity.
Speaker 3:Um, because they, they do some things that, again, I still don't fully understand, but I'm, I think, as one stays curious and just allows them to explore and still bring truth and still share the truth about Jesus and all of those things to them, I think that's it. But it's just a man, you, you, it's just it's going to unfold as it unfolds. So I I'm grateful for all the work that they do. I have some sixth and seventh graders that I see now and and I they're navigating some things and some behavior issues and this and that. So it gets crazy. I know it gets crazy as they start navigating that, but, like you said, brad, crazy. I know it gets crazy as they start navigating that, but, like you said, brad, I think it's just a matter of posturing yourself to like, hey man, what may have worked before may not work with these set of kids coming up here the times they are a change in for sure.
Speaker 1:Uh, bob Dylan, even today prescient. We appreciate you, bob. Okay, josh, this has been a treat. I really appreciate the work that you are doing with this age group and I appreciate First Baptist of Orlando and the impact that they have on a community that I love, and I appreciate your work with Superstart and that we get to partner together in ministry, and I just think you're great.
Speaker 3:Thanks for being here, appreciate you, man. Real quick I just want to um for any preteen leader that may be listening, if it's okay, just plug this devotional real quick. But I think we did a, like I said, we kind of talked about those things, uh, friendships, bullying, conflict and choices and just how all of those things play a part. So if y'all are navigating that, there's a devotional star strong that we created. You see how I did that. You saw that right there. Let me do that again. There's a devotional star strong that we created that you can pick up on Amazon and it kind of explores that and it gives, especially with the whole bullying thing.
Speaker 3:I observe that, man, when leaders are having conversation with kids, there's so much growth that happens. What does it look like to put some curriculum in the hand of parents for them to have those conversations, because they're with them so much more? So I just think the feedback that we've been getting on that and the parents navigating through and having those conversations early, it's just been great. So if they're looking for something, I think that might be helpful.
Speaker 1:Start strong. Is that what it's called?
Speaker 4:Start strong.
Speaker 1:Is that what it's called Start Strong, available on Amazon? We'll also link that in the show notes. Thanks a ton, josh.
Speaker 2:Josh, you're the best.
Speaker 1:Josh Celestin.
Speaker 2:Celestin.
Speaker 1:Every time. Great dude Really loved that conversation. Gen Alpha wild thing to talk about crazy. Because I like, literally when I look back on that conversation I'm like, wow, brad, you are so scatterbrained, like, but it's such a big topic that we don't know anything about and it's like crazy.
Speaker 2:This is the first really conversation on the podcast you guys have had about gen alpha. Correct me if I'm wrong. No, yeah, absolutely this is the first of many in the years to come. Like you know, we've talked about gen z for a long time.
Speaker 1:Now we're like maybe we have a graphs on what gen z is, but this is just the beginning, yeah but it was very, very cool to even hit some of those big um 30 000 foot view kind of points about, yeah, this generation. I think my biggest takeaway honestly is just we. We have to be, we have to know that we're on the cusp of a change here. Yeah, we're changing of the guard gen z handing the baton to gen alpha when it comes to student ministry as we speak, and being willing to analyze our programs and our strategies and know that what worked in the past has not worked in the future. I really love that. He kind of threw that out.
Speaker 2:I love that the playbook changes, but the thing that doesn't is still the teaching of who Jesus is. That 100%, but everything around that and how it points to him yeah, just being flexible and, as Josh said, get ready get ready, Get ready.
Speaker 1:I want you to get ready to read that blessing. I can't wait.
Speaker 2:Okay, let me do that. May God show you grace and bless you. May he make his face shine on you. May you experience the love of Christ, through whom God gives you fullness of life. May you be strengthened by his power. May Christ himself make his home in your heart, that you would be full of his love and grace and that those you serve would see Jesus in you.
Speaker 1:Today's episode was produced by Michael Hester, lauren Bryan and myself. Thanks a ton to Corey for being here. Thanks to Josh for being here. It was a really great conversation. If you liked what you heard, please feel free to subscribe to our show on YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts. We're going to be back in a couple of weeks to talk with a fellow named Jordan Francis. We're going to be talking about mental health. It's going to be a great conversation, one that a lot of us probably need to engage in, even if we don't really want to Talking to you, brad. So be sure to tune in in a couple weeks. In the meantime, you can reach out to us on the CYY Community Facebook group or by email podcastatcyycom. We'll see you next time. Thank you.