Beyond the Event: A Youth Ministry Podcast
Bringing together influential voices from the CIY community to walk alongside you in your journey to maintain momentum between the mountaintop experiences of youth ministry.
Beyond the Event: A Youth Ministry Podcast
BTE4.04: Scaling for Growth: Budget with Tom Hahn and Korey Klein
Mailbag questions or topic suggestions? Text us!
Meet Tom Hahn, the "everything pastor" at Restoration Christian Church, who shares his journey of dedication and community engagement. Tom's story is one of faith and resilience, detailing how he transformed a modest church gathering into a thriving community with limited resources.
We also chat about the upcoming SuperStart 2025 tour, celebrating 20 impactful years of preteen ministry.
Finding quiet amidst the chaos of bustling church events can be a challenge. We discuss the different ways individuals seek spiritual nourishment during such times, with Brad sharing how he finds solace in the company of other believers, rather than in solitude. This conversation explores the concept of events as "thin spaces," moments where we feel closer to God, and acknowledges the diverse ways people experience their faith. Whether through solitary moments or communal experiences, we embrace the unique nature of everyone's relationship with God and the idea that spiritual practice isn't one-size-fits-all.
Our lively discussion also takes us on a ride from Muncie to French Lick, Indiana, chronicling Tom's adventurous journey of faith during the COVID-19 pandemic. He recounts moving and building a church community from the ground up, highlighting the importance of embracing change and trusting in God's plan, even when it's uncertain. We dive into the innovative, low-control, high-support model that empowers youth ministry in French Lick, fostering student ownership and community engagement. From the logistics of budgeting in ministry to the excitement of youth camps, this episode underscores the transformative power of aligning the church's vision with God's vision, inspiring growth and development within the community.
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So get this Michael Yep. Tom works at a church, yep, where he is the only staff member. Yes, no part-time staff, no full-time staff. What size group would you guess that he is bringing to move? Oh, gosh. See, I bet the answer is going to shock me like a but like just pretend that I'm not being clickbaity, just like. How many people would you?
Speaker 3:if I think my assumption would be 1,200 people.
Speaker 1:I would.
Speaker 2:I would bet six students.
Speaker 1:They are currently registered to bring 60 students to move.
Speaker 2:Dang yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 1:Hi, I'm Brad Warren, and this is Beyond the Event, a youth ministry podcast presented by Christ in Youth, where we help you maintain momentum between the mountaintops. Today is a continuation of a conversation that we started a couple weeks ago about how to scale for growth. A lot of churches out there are growing, and that's really exciting and very encouraging to me and to all my brothers and sisters here at Christ in Youth, and so we just wanted to have a few conversations about how to grow not like how to grow, but the infrastructure that you have to put in place around that growth in order to make sure that you're able to take care of all of the people that God has entrusted to your care. Joining me today my co-host, the beautiful Corey Klein. Thank you, Brad Corey. Ask me about my coffee mug, yeah.
Speaker 3:Hey, Brad, I noticed you have a really cool coffee mug. I can't say words. What am I looking at? What is this so?
Speaker 1:this is a beautiful coffee mug. Those who are watching on YouTube they see it. They can see it. Michael got me this. Isn't that nice? Michael and I are both from the great Commonwealth of Kentucky. Where's that? And it's in the United States of America. It borders Virginia, north Carolina, tennessee, missouri, illinois.
Speaker 3:Indiana and Ohio.
Speaker 1:Okay, and West Virginia Cool, of course. Hatfields and McCoys. How could I forget? Um, so, anyway, we're both from Kentucky. Michael went and hiked at red river gorge, which is the most beautiful state park in the country.
Speaker 3:Is it really Michael?
Speaker 2:It is very, very beautiful.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Most beautiful.
Speaker 2:I haven't been to all the state parks, okay, so great answer.
Speaker 3:Great answer, I guess.
Speaker 1:Kentucky is celebrating 100 years of their state parks.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So Michael got me this great mug, which was a very thoughtful and sweet gift.
Speaker 3:That's really nice of you, michael.
Speaker 2:I really did. My sister can vouch, not that we're going to take the time to ask.
Speaker 3:Let's pull her in right now.
Speaker 2:I saw that mug and I said, oh, Brad would like that. You were right.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Michael.
Speaker 2:You're welcome.
Speaker 1:I love it. Anyway, this episode is releasing the day before election day. Who you voting for? Well?
Speaker 3:on that note. Uh, just kidding.
Speaker 1:Elections are wild man. They're so crazy, we're gonna talk.
Speaker 3:You know, jesus is on the throne. Jesus is on the throne.
Speaker 1:We got better stuff to talk about come on now better stuff to talk about, like, uh like, super start, yes, you're the director of super start?
Speaker 3:I am, yes and um. I love super start you're very good at your your job when you come to super starts, by the way, really, yeah, am I? So brad gets to direct a few super starts every year, and it used to be a few. This coming year it's a couple, it's two.
Speaker 1:I got demoted.
Speaker 3:No, you didn't get demoted.
Speaker 1:I went from three to two.
Speaker 3:It's true.
Speaker 1:You're telling me that I do a good job, but what I'm picking up, what I'm receiving from you is last year you got to do three.
Speaker 3:This year you get to do two. Yeah, I want to make sure that those two are really really good and you will bring that to the two. It's a capacity thing. It's that's all. I couldn't do. Three really well, yeah, yeah. So I know you got this podcast too. Yeah, you got the podcast, so I didn't want to interfere with that I get it.
Speaker 1:um, it is one of the the pleasures of my life to direct Super Start. I always get to go back to the Commonwealth of Kentucky, to my home state, and actually the guy that we're talking to today always comes to that event Super Start in. Kentucky.
Speaker 4:His name is Tom.
Speaker 1:Hahn. He is the everything pastor at Restoration Christian Church in french lake, indiana, and uh, so be sure to hang around because we're going to talk to tom and tom is really a truly wonderful guy and, uh, I I really cherish every opportunity that I get to talk with him. Every year at super start. There's always like one session that he skips like 30 minutes of so that he can stand in the lobby and talk to me, gotcha, and it's one of my favorite times of every year he skips session, just like 30 minutes.
Speaker 3:Okay, that's okay.
Speaker 1:It's not that he like intentionally skips it's that he is a super personable guy For sure. And so we just get to talking and it's like you know that train is moving, it ain't stopping I love it. I love it so yeah, this could be a three-hour podcast, I don't know we'll see what happens. We'll see what happens anyway. Uh, cory, what are you excited about for superstar in 2025?
Speaker 3:five. First off, that's crazy that that's a year 2025. A few things, but the number one thing I'm excited about for those who don't know this will be 20 years of SuperCert, when we hit tour in 2025. 20 years of God using this preteen ministry, this conference, to further the kingdom of God. So 20 years, 2005 to 2025. So we're just going to get to celebrate in different ways throughout next year, which I'm excited about.
Speaker 3:I'm also really excited about our theme, which it's out there. You could check it out on CIOI website if you have not seen it yet. But we're looking at Proverbs 4.23, about guarding your heart above all else, for it determines your path, and basically, what we're going to be talking about is this word of influence and the things in your life. They shape you, whether you know it or not. So we get to talk with 10, 11, 12 year olds about, hey, the things that you take in in your life, good and bad, they shape you, but also, on the other side, you're shaping others. So what our team from Rob to others on content is creating and writing right now for your students to just fully know who Jesus is and how he is shaping their hearts. It's just, I believe, going to be one of the most powerful years of superstar, and so I'm looking forward to that too. Yeah, I'm.
Speaker 1:I'm I'm really looking forward to it.
Speaker 3:I love it.
Speaker 1:Actually, uh, today is our uh staff cleaning day which is fun. I smell terrible, right now I smell like Clorox wipes. Um but we clean everything head to toe, little little, uh little dusting of the whole property and everything that we own. Yeah, and I was in a Sprinter, I was on van duty, I was cleaning out all the vans.
Speaker 1:And I was in one of the not Sprinters, the people movers, yeah, and the only time I'm ever in those things is when I go to Superstar, superstar, and I was in one cleaning it out and I was like man, I cannot wait to load this thing up and drive it all the way to Louisville, kentucky, and and have superstars.
Speaker 3:You'll be with a great crew as well, will I? Patrick Snow will be with you.
Speaker 1:I love Patrick.
Speaker 3:He's the best, so you're just going to have a great time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a lot of board games, probably a lot of board games games probably card games, a lot of board games, yeah that's gonna be good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it'll be a good time. Michael, are you going to that one? Um, I don't know yet you better.
Speaker 1:The tradition is that we go michael always production manages superstar kentucky or typically yeah, typically I've done it, I've done it twice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'll most likely be likely be there, but we just don't know.
Speaker 1:Yes, and Michael's mom, margie, cooks us all a dinner.
Speaker 3:That's amazing. What does she cook? Chili, ooh Chili, spaghetti, cincinnati style chili.
Speaker 2:So, but it's not the same as like Skyline. Yeah, I was going to say better than.
Speaker 3:Skyline for sure.
Speaker 2:It's more soupy than like Skyline would be. Because, Skyline comes in like plates.
Speaker 4:Yeah, right.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, majority of the time. No, we do bowls. Okay, but it's chili over spaghetti.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and cheese. And then obviously that's a very controversial dish. Some people don't like it, yeah, so Margie also typically has another option as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, very smart. Well, yeah, the noodles are always like separate. Yeah, okay, even, like, even.
Speaker 1:But she made like a creamy potato soup last time too. That was pretty baller, it was so good. I mean, she raised 12 children, so I would assume she could cook a very, very good meal. Yeah, she can, yeah.
Speaker 3:So that's, amazing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, by the way, if anyone doesn't know, that's not an exaggeration, it's not. Michael has 11 siblings.
Speaker 3:Where are you at in the order of siblings Number?
Speaker 1:five.
Speaker 3:I'm number five, but I'm the youngest. You're number five but then they stop.
Speaker 1:Perfection I only have one brother and it's insane for me to think I literally can't even wrap my head around even being part of a family where there are five yeah, yeah, siblings much less there's 12. 12, just a wild time. Are you the oldest or youngest? Uh, I'm older okay, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I have one younger brother, okay, so yep siblings different lives.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean way different. Yeah, we've oh, this is fun, we've got like oldest child energy, middle child energy.
Speaker 3:Youngest. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, which you?
Speaker 1:definitely bring.
Speaker 3:Do I, yes, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1:You're totally a youngest child.
Speaker 3:You just know it. Yeah, you just don't like care what anybody thinks about you. That's true, you know that's true, I feel like that's a youngest child thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so. All right, that's enough of that. Do we have mailbag? Do we have mailbag questions? I'll be honest, we're running a little bit low. Okay, there is actually a link in our show notes now where you can text us mailbag questions.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's amazing, that's really cool.
Speaker 1:I know so technology do that right now unless you're driving. But even if you're at a red light, go ahead and text. We have amazing people on this podcast all the time like Corey Klein and want to answer your questions. So you can text us those questions, you can email, you can do whatever you know just get them to us. So we're running a little low, but we do have another question for sweet sweet Corey.
Speaker 3:Oh, we do.
Speaker 1:Okay, I guess.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I said.
Speaker 1:The way you said that made it sound like you had a question in mind, but no, I don't write into that.
Speaker 3:I don't do questions this is a time where Brad doesn't have to talk, so yeah, okay, we have a question.
Speaker 2:I really really like this question.
Speaker 3:Oh, I'm so excited.
Speaker 2:I think that it might be a little bit challenging, a question from our dear friend Haley Fouts. Oh, I love Haley.
Speaker 3:She's one of our backstage managers for Superstar. One of our backstage managers for Superstar when she gets back from a long-term mission in Hawaii, hawaii.
Speaker 1:Real difficult place, I'm so sorry that God called you to Hawaii, hawaii, hawaii.
Speaker 2:Yeah, real difficult place. Yeah, I'm so sorry that God called you to Hawaii, Haley I can't wait to hear about all the ways that Haley learned to be challenged by her discomfort, how the Lord strengthened her to hang out on the beach and in the jungle and eat poke bowls, and eat poke bowls, and eat poke bowls. Anyway, haley's asking this question.
Speaker 3:What does personal quiet time look like?
Speaker 1:at an event Like for staff. For staff, yeah, no.
Speaker 2:I said it would be challenging.
Speaker 3:When I close my eyes Friday night and I go to bed. No, but seriously, um, I would say, if I'm looking at a weekend of Superstar cause for me that's 10 years of my life. Um, there's these. There's these moments in the afternoon on a Friday when I used to act, where I would really try to find 30 minutes to an hour.
Speaker 3:I mean, you guys know there's some, there is some downtime on those Fridays to just whether that's going backstage, going outside around the church building, whatever it is, and there's been times where I've read a book or I've literally put in my AirPods and listened to some music to just center my mind and like on what God is going to do. So there are moments not a whole lot, but on a weekend of Superstar, to just center your mind and heart on Christ. But also, honestly, just backstage, even right before, like during the sessions, I'm just waiting. It sounds weird, but waiting in the darkness before going out there and, instead of being with everyone in the green room or whatnot, just waiting and just praying and thinking about what God is going to do in that next moment, um, before going out on stage or as a director, that next moment before talking with adult leader, or encountering and talking to a student. Um, that's, that's what it is for me, brad. What about you? Do you find moments at events?
Speaker 1:Um, I'm going to be. I'm trying to think of how honest I want to be in this very public forum about this. Um, because this is, uh, you know what I'm just going for it be honest, full send that's what this is this is beyond the events, be honest.
Speaker 1:Um, I do not even try to get personal quiet time when I'm at an event and, uh, events are also like thin spaces for me where I feel closer to God than probably anywhere else. For sure, um, and I think it is because I am surrounded by like a community of believers all the time and I think it's just like okay that for that season, that's how I'm filled is through that community. And then you get home and there's plenty of time to like get back into a rhythm and create some space where I can be just just me and God. But I'm going to be honest, where I can be just me and God. But I'm going to be honest, I think faith is something that is meant to be communal and I try to be in the Word every single day. I definitely pray all the time, but having a personal quiet time every single day is not something that is a priority for me.
Speaker 3:That's great, like where I'm just by myself and quiet yeah. Michael Definitely occasionally, but not every day.
Speaker 2:I think that's a real thing. I think thinking of events as thin spaces is a pretty great way to put it. Yeah, which I would say kind of contrasts like a challenge that I had when I was a student at Ozark Christian College, where I was coasting a lot on like Bible classes and being in the word because I was in the classroom and then when I graduated I was like not having regular times like reading scripture or anything like that, and that was that was, you know, not super awesome, but I think at an event it is. It is different because it's a it's. I don't even know how to try and frame up like what, like how it is different, but but there's so much going on that allows us to see so clearly and so closely, I think, the way that the Lord is working. Um, yeah, I mean, I think I think thinking of it as a thin space is a great way to frame that up and why, why it's like you know, not like well, brad, you should work harder.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, having quiet time. Yeah, here's the deal. I'm not really into. I'm just not really into making myself feel guilty. Yeah, Over that.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, and I don't think anybody should yeah.
Speaker 4:I don't Everyone's different.
Speaker 1:But I mean everyone is different and there are people that like really strongly prioritize, like I need 30 minutes alone with just me and God every day, and that is not an expression that my faith and my relationship with God has really ever taken in my life people might think people might think I'm a heathen.
Speaker 3:The way you meet and encounter God is in that way, which is beautiful.
Speaker 1:I mean I do, we all do, yes, yeah like I have. There's a group of guys that come over to my house every other friday morning. Michael's in that group of people cool and like.
Speaker 1:That's when I feel close to god and we're sitting around and like talking about, hey, what are the really good things that god is doing in your life and how do you need to be encouraged? Yeah, and like that community and that it is a biblical community, it is a scripturally focused and centered community, is like that for me you know, I don't know, yeah, yeah, if that makes sense, or not.
Speaker 2:No, that makes sense. Yeah, I don't. I I would say I never really have consistent rhythms at events. I always try to like have something. There are some events where it's like super consistent. It might be like right before I go to bed, which is typically the easiest time to be able to do it.
Speaker 2:I'm not a morning person, so I don't like having to wake up any earlier than I, you know, have to Um, but sometimes you know, like I'll try, like I'll, I'll, I'll do it before I actually leave, you know, the room or the dorm or you know wherever. Um, this past summer, something that I did, um, as often as I could. It was not always feasible, but this was something I actually really, really enjoyed doing. Um, you know, of course we were going through Psalm 23. And every opportunity that I had I would try at least once during whatever week, I would try and go by myself somewhere, like in nature, that was like near the event to read Psalm 23 and, you know, maybe read other scripture and spend time journaling and in prayer. So I did it one week in California, where I went all the way out, I think, to Laguna Beach, oh wow, and just found a trail that's a little bit down from where Laguna Beach proper is and just sat on a bench that overlooked the shoreline. It was pretty cool, that's really cool.
Speaker 1:um, and then one time in pennsylvania just found this like I had to walk through somebody's backyard to get here, so you know, maybe it was fine um but like I thought you were gonna say maybe it was trespassing it was like it definitely was.
Speaker 3:I mean it was he's like it's good.
Speaker 2:But, like I found, you know, there was this like overlook in the woods that just like was sitting on top of like a valley that I was able to sit and, you know, read Psalm 23 there and yeah, it was just. It was something that was always so encouraging and refreshing, and getting to read scripture and especially scripture that's intended to be so restful, in a place that also was restful. It was just a. It was a unique experience. I don't get to do it all the time. I and I I want to try and do something like that more regularly.
Speaker 1:That's really cool.
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, Joplin is not like Laguna Beach Joplin is not like Laguna Beach or like the Appalachia, no, but we have good sunsets. We have good sunsets, sometimes, sometimes.
Speaker 3:Every once in a while we sure do Every once in a while. A nice sunset, and you know what the horizon in Joplin is not much. Yeah, it is not much. Yeah, it's yep not much going on.
Speaker 1:Oh, it's a place. Great question, Haley, that is a good question.
Speaker 3:That was a good you know we all kind of agreed but disagreed in all our different ways and I loved it. So, yeah, it was great. Yeah, we're all different.
Speaker 1:I'm nervous about people hearing me of that, but I don't know.
Speaker 3:You gotta be honest.
Speaker 1:I know I know beyond this I know, be honest, the event um is that it? Yeah, okay, that's our mailbag question for the day. Um, cory, yeah, thanks for being here. I'm excited. Uh, you want to talk to tom? Let's talk to tommy, so glad that you're here. Thanks for hanging out. You're one of my favorite people in the whole world.
Speaker 4:You say that to every person who's on here. I literally know you. We have a lot of favorite people, he does.
Speaker 1:Have you listened to this podcast before?
Speaker 4:It sounds like he has. I've listened to a few episodes.
Speaker 1:I do not say you are one of my favorite people in the whole world. To everyone. Yes, you do I absolutely do not, but Michael. Michael has been here for every episode of the last three seasons. Do I say that to everybody who comes on With different words? You say that to most everyone Like.
Speaker 2:Last time we had Tyler Lamel and that interview started with.
Speaker 1:Tyler Okay, bestie, I was the best man in Tyler's wedding.
Speaker 2:Okay, sure, that's actually a real one. It is a real one.
Speaker 1:Just because these happen to be back to back episodes, whatever, I'm not going to defend myself. Hey, listen, you're good.
Speaker 4:I appreciate the significance of that statement. It's good to be in that company of people, because I will say this if you've said it to other people, I'm sure they're really cool people too, so you know. So there you go.
Speaker 1:I only have cool people on this podcast, so there you go.
Speaker 2:Tom, you're not wrong, though. We're not making we're not making a statement about people who have not been on the podcast. So there you go. There you go, tom. You're not wrong, though you're not making we are not making a statement about people who have not been on the podcast.
Speaker 4:Right so for my teenage children who don't think I'm cool. This confirms the fact that you are in fact cool yeah, tom is cool.
Speaker 1:Um, I met uh tom in muncie, indiana, which is a town that I never thought that I would ever go to.
Speaker 3:And then I did.
Speaker 1:And Muncie Indiana is not. I mean, it's not great, it's fine, you know, like it's a good town.
Speaker 3:College town.
Speaker 4:It's a college town.
Speaker 1:There's some cool things, but it's like very ordinary Indiana Like the joke is that Jerry in Parks and Rec has a vacation home in.
Speaker 4:Muncie, indiana, and that's like meant to be funny because Muncie is like just whatever. Right.
Speaker 1:Why would you have a vacation home in Muncie Indiana? Why would you have a vacation home in Muncie Indiana? But, then you moved. I went to a more obscure place, to a more obscure place than Muncie Indiana. I know. Thank you, Lord. So how'd you get from Muncie to French Lick? I don't even know, actually, if I know this whole story. French Lick, Indiana, home of the great Larry Bird. Yeah, the hick from.
Speaker 4:French Lick. There you go, which my wife said. When I proposed the idea of going to French Lick Indiana, she said I'm not moving to French Lick. What am I going to be? A French licker, like you know. So, hey, this is a family show. Yeah, no doubt. But I guess, to spare you all the agonizing details, the gist was that my wife and I kind of felt the spirit of God saying that it was time for us to trust him in a new season and so, in one of the worst possible times, to try and buy and sell a house. We sold our house during COVID and said Lord, our house is sold, where do you want us to go? And he said French Lick Indianaiana.
Speaker 3:Amazing so so you sold your house and everything before knowing about french lick, correct, okay, wow, yes, so you moved to french, yeah, and you know, I mean I had I had some, I had some really good friends in my life.
Speaker 4:um shout out to Pete Coco no relation to Glenn Coco no.
Speaker 4:But my point is they were kind of confirming these suspicions. Because I was like, hey, you know, because at that time, if I do some math, my kids were sixth grade, fourth grade and kindergarten first grade or maybe fifth, third kindergarten, whatever and my biggest concern with uprooting my family because we never thought we'd ever leave Muncie was I don't want this to be a selfish reason for me to move, because I don't want my kids to have to suffer just because dad wants a new gig or you know whatever, whatever that looks like. And so I had people in my life that we were praying like is this the right move? You know, it's not like. It's not like overnight we just put our house up for sale.
Speaker 4:I actually had kind of a vision of I don't know why. I was in worship one day and I saw a for sale sign in my yard and I in my mind, and I didn't know what that meant, I'm like that's really weird. Never thought I'd sell my house, uh, and it kind of went from there and in a time span of probably nine months from that kind of Holy cow, are you for real? We, our house was sold. It sold in two days because we sold it during that COVID time when, like, houses started going stupid yeah.
Speaker 1:And um interest rates were 2% or whatever. Yeah, yeah, that was fun.
Speaker 4:Then we got into a house on the other side. I don't know if this is a financial management seminar, but in some ways it actually is yeah, so kudos to me. Yeah, there you go, but yeah, so that that's how we ended up in French Lick and I just I had met the elders of this church, um, through actually a college website.
Speaker 1:They were saying that they needed a pastor and I was like, maybe and we met and yeah so that's how we ended up in french, and the rest is history. And uh, you work on a great team there, lots of wonderful co-workers who we all know and love, right, actually?
Speaker 4:you caught me in the middle of a staff meeting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, with just you and you um, everyone's here, uh, so you work. I. I want to kind of recap this again work at a church by yourself. There, there is nobody on staff at the church you attend. Besides you full-time, part-time or otherwise tom is the employee and we are having you on a podcast about growth, because this is insane two years ago, you brought 20 people to move four years ago we bought three.
Speaker 4:That was our first move event from French Lick Right Me, my son and one of our eldest daughters.
Speaker 1:Okay, and that's not actually even in our database, because you attended with another church.
Speaker 4:No, that's right.
Speaker 1:So four years ago you brought three. Three years ago you brought 20 people. Last year you more than doubled that total and brought 49 people to move. Last year you more than doubled that total and brought 49 people to move, and this year you were registered to bring 60 people to move from a church that has one full-time staff member does not have a building meets in, if I remember correctly, a movie theater Is that right.
Speaker 4:We used to meet in the movie theater. We meet in high school auditorium now. Okay.
Speaker 1:Very good which is really cool.
Speaker 4:I actually love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, has that been a good move.
Speaker 4:It really has been good. You know, I think, I think I think all the youth pastors, uh, and youth workers that watch this show can relate to the fact that one of the struggles that we all have as people, but students specifically have, is being different people in different places. You know, like, hey, I can be this kid in youth group, I can be this kid at home, I can be this kid on the football team, and it's like, as long as they all don't find out, right, don't want pastor, you know, youth pastor to find out. You know that this is the way I talk around these set of friends, and I think there's something that is cool about the fact that these students show up and worship at their school. Yeah, on a Sunday, yeah.
Speaker 1:At least that's the way I look at it. I think it's pretty unique For sure. Yeah, that is cool. How long have you guys been doing that?
Speaker 1:That's been a little over a year. A little over a year Okay, very good. A year A year Okay, very good. So, as you've grown, the conversation that we want to have is about money financial planning seminar, if you will, because budgets are hard and most people who are in ministry, budgets are kind of a difficult thing for them. And I think budgets are even harder when you're kind of like holding on to God's coattails and just like experiencing the kind of crazy growth that you're experiencing, at least within the youth ministry at your church and, I think, at the church overall.
Speaker 1:So it's like if you under budget, like if you shoot low, if you aim really, really conservative, then it's possible that you might not be able to do all of the things that you would want to do for all of the students who show up to your ministry.
Speaker 1:If you over budget, if you kind of get ahead, put the cart before the horse a little bit, then it's possible that you might not end up being able to afford some of the things that you were planning to do or get yourself in a little bit of a bind and, um, you know, one of the reasons I wanted to have you on here is because I think you, like me, are a little bit of a, a little bit of a renegade, maybe a little bit like know, whatever kind of um you're, you're not the kind of guy who's like extremely um you're. You're not going to embed yourself in an Excel sheet on a Monday afternoon, uh, and you're going to kind of like leave a little bit of wiggle room and a little bit of freedom for God to do whatever he's going to do. Has that? Have you experienced friction there at all with, like, elders or other people at your church, or do you feel like they're kind of all on board.
Speaker 4:You know, it's kind of interesting. Like one of the you know, I guess maybe a lot of us were feeling this way during COVID, when the world was like blowing up, that there were things going on in the church that weren't working, like big c church, like and, and so I guess when I came down here, I came down here. The reason I guess the reason I was attracted to a church without a building, is because I wanted to go someplace and and and there's not. It's not all positive, it's all net positive to not like, not have a building and not be long you know, long established. I mean, obviously there's all net positive to not have a building and not be long established. I mean obviously there's a lot of benefit to having a very established church community.
Speaker 4:I didn't really feel like they had a lot of like there weren't things that I had to tear down because I wanted to build something new. You know what I mean? It was just like, hey, we're ready for the new thing, and that was I guess that was what God really kind of laid on my heart when we made the move is like, god, do you want something different? Yeah, you know, like, and I guess at that time and still to some degree, I'm convinced that he does, other than when you're dealing with a small community.
Speaker 1:Sometimes it's difficult for them to think bigger, small community in your church or in like the surrounding community?
Speaker 4:Yes, yes and yes you know, because this is a very rooted community. It's not a transient community whatsoever. You know, when we came in it was like hey, who are the new people?
Speaker 1:you know, like it's not, like there's a military or something taking people in and out right, you know, right it's not
Speaker 4:like. It's not like, oh, it's just another person who decided to move to french Lick because everybody wants to move to French Lick, you know, and so, and so the I guess the only friction is is like is our vision, does our vision match, you know, god's vision as it pertains to size? Or are we limited because we think, oh well, that's just the way we do things at this church?
Speaker 1:You know what I mean, so I don't want to put words in your mouth by any means. So it sounds like the kind of imagery that popped into my mind is, when you came in to restoration, there weren't a lot of sacred cows, there wasn't a lot of culture or cultural battle that needed to be fought.
Speaker 1:It was just like kind of a blank slate and you and the elders are walking in step um toward whatever the vision is. So it sounds like. Maybe the friction then is that the vision. Uh, it's harder to catch a larger vision for people who live in a small community and attend a smaller church.
Speaker 4:Right, because in some and I think this is true in all cases but we already have in our mind, when it comes to any situation, what's possible. And so when you are saying, okay, god, you're sending him here because you want something new, what that means is, god, you want to see something happen that has not happened before in this community. And so, therefore, it's like, how do you get people to believe that that's possible? And I mean, I think that's, I think that's the challenge for any pastor of a church or youth pastor, because it's like you come in and you're like, hey, I want to, I don't want to just do status quo, like you know, and whether that looks like growth, whether that looks like community engagement, whether that looks like, you know, you know missional goals or whatever it is, you you have to. You have to figure out how to increase people's imagination on what is possible.
Speaker 1:For sure, that's the job of the prophet, right?
Speaker 4:It's like right To write that picture, yeah and so and so you know there are some you know and and I think every environment has, you know things that are kind of cultural norms, and so it's like, okay, how do we break out of those and trust God for something?
Speaker 1:bigger budgeting and money and the ways that that impacts growth and the ways that we respond to growth. When it comes to money, I kind of want to start by maybe doing a little bit of a case study kind of thing. So you're in the middle of a season of growth which you have been in basically the entire time you've been at restoration. Um, what are the money like? What are the pinch points right now? What are the conversations, what are the difficult things when it comes to how you budget alongside the growth of your church and even like playing into that what we were talking about with the competing visions a little bit I think, I think the biggest thing, and I think initially, and I think it first of all, I think, as it relates to budgeting for ciy, um it, it's expensive for a family, oh yeah, sure especially when you start having multiple kids wanting to go and
Speaker 4:all that kind of stuff. It's not, it's not cheap, and so I think and again, people feel a certain way about an event. You know what I mean, because people who haven't been there don't understand what really happens in that five days. So when I think about the conversations that happen, initially I think it was convincing families that in a, in a community that did not have, like I didn't want, like I know, a lot of youth pastors walk into a community and it's like, oh, there's this group that meets over here, there's this youth group over here at this church and there's this youth group and there's this. Walk into a community where there is no youth group. Okay, so there haven't been kids going to youth camp, there haven't been. So there haven't been kids going to youth camp, there haven't been. And so budgeting as a standpoint for CIY really started with trying to convince families that it was worth it, both time and money, and then convincing volunteers that they should take a week off work to come and be a part of something called CIY with students.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so were you asking students to foot the entire bill for going, or were you able to like, build, like? How did that all work?
Speaker 4:Well, I think you know it's hard because you know, when you, when any youth pastor says, hey, we're going to go to CIY, Right, and maybe there are those churches out there that are like, no, you just go get the kids and we'll pay for it, and I and I don't, I don't think that was the environment that we are in. So it's like you've got to list some sort of price tag and then I think you know as being even remembering my days in Muncie as a youth pastor. It's like, well, you want to let people know that there's financial assistance available, but you don't want to advertise it because you don't want people that don't need to use it use it when they could pay for that trip themselves.
Speaker 1:But you also don't want somebody to not go because they can't afford it, and so the conversations for us have always been, especially for me.
Speaker 4:Whenever we tell people about CIY, you tell them all the great reasons why they should go, what it's going to be like, and then you say, oh, and here's what it's cost. But money shouldn't be the reason that you don't go. You know, yeah, and so that those conversations were having were happening. You know, initially I wouldn't say that there was any friction or pushback from our elder team. I think it was more of the students going what Do I want? To spend a week at church camp, like I don't know, that is not something I'm a familiar with. I don't have a lot of friends that are telling me about experiences that they had at church camp. And oh, there's a church camp down the road that I went to as a kid, so why don't we just go there? That was really like really do you need to take kids to Lee university? We have a camp near us and it's like, well, this is different, right, yeah, you know this is different.
Speaker 4:And so initially I think all those conversations we're having, but now I think our community in particular is seeing the results of how powerful a week long experience can be, and I don't even think they question it now. Yeah, but I do know that last year because we also I mean, I think I'd have to double check orange county is like the third poorest county in indiana, so we're also not a very affluent community and we also aren't in a habit of paying for a lot of things as a church, if that makes sense. We don't have a mortgage payment, we don't have a huge light bill and huge staff costs. You know, we're used to not really having to front very many bills. If that makes sense, yeah, and so I know last year when I I thought, oh my goodness, we're gonna go from like 14 students to 48 students. I wonder how many of those students aren't gonna be able to afford to pay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when did that grow? Where did that come from? Was that like students coming back telling friends and bringing them? Or was it that the church was attracting a lot more families and they like where did all of these people come from?
Speaker 4:Honestly, for us in our community it really started with myself and another lady from our church who's pretty influential in our youth community. We started getting involved in FCA and we saw a huge uptick in FCA numbers. Like we have graduating classes of around 60 to 70 here at Springs Valley and we have well over 100 students every week coming to FCA. And so I think a lot of that and also, like when we came to French Lick, my kids knew what like a happening youth group looked like Sure, and they didn't see it when they got here and they were disappointed Because when we got here my son was just getting into sixth grade and that was like now I can stop being the youth pastor's kid and I can show up to youth group.
Speaker 4:And then when we got here it was like, oh, what youth group you know, looking around and seeing three students. So I think my kids played a pretty influential part in that because they were champions of CIY already before they even ever went to CIY, because they had been jealously watching all these cool kids in our church that they looked up to get to go to CIY, and so I think they've been a huge part of spreading the word and saying, hey, this is something that's important, and in a small community like ours it just kind of caught fire Are a lot of the kids that you're bringing, students who don't regularly attend restoration.
Speaker 4:I would say a lot of them do now. Okay, I mean, there's like I don't know, it's so crazy Like in our little community there's like 55 churches, but most of them are like 12 people Right, yeah, and most of them have the same last name that show up to church, right, and so biblical literacy is very low in our community with students. And so I think there's a genuineness that they feel from the gospel that in some communities where it's like, well, I've been invited to 95 youth groups and 95 youth events my whole life and I'm around it all the time, that's not the situation here at all, yeah, and so I think there was a genuineness. And then you know how it is when you go to CIY and you feel Christian community for maybe the first time. It's like this isn't real, right, and so I think we have a lot of students feeling that. I think we have a lot of students feeling that.
Speaker 4:And then, and then we have a very low control, uh, high support model of youth ministry in French lick Like we don't have youth group that meets every single week. We got a Bible study that meets on Thursday mornings. We rely very heavily on hey, you should be at FCA, because that's your and and and it's not, it's not our meeting, it's not our, it's their thing, yeah. And so I think you have a lot of students who are like man, this is my thing, yeah, like this is my time, like I want, yeah. And so there's been a.
Speaker 4:There's been a high level of ownership amongst our students and I've done less work to create that than when I was spinning my wheels for 12 years trying to figure out how to go from 18 students to 25 students. You know what I mean Like um, so yeah, so now it's. But I do remember, like, as far as budgeting is concerned, I remember when we made that really big jump two years ago, I was like how many of these students are not going to be able to afford a thing? Because I had student after student telling me I want to go to CYY, I want to go to CYY, I want to go to CYY, and then it's like I don't even know who your parents are. I want to go to CY, and then it's like I don't even know who your parents are.
Speaker 3:Like, do you have like? Do you live with your parents? What's the situation?
Speaker 4:Right, like and so. But I think then we had again and it was kind of that perfect storm, because I told you, we don't write a lot of checks for a lot of things as a church community. So when our church, when our faithful church body, saw all these young people showing up and wanting to worship with hands raised and wanting to be at church and wanting to, you know, in a community where I think most churches are going well, why do young people not love God anymore? Why don't they want to come to church? We kind of have this opposite problem where we have a lot of mouths to feed and very few people that are going to work. You know like, and but I but I think our faithful community saw that and I didn't have to worry because you know how it is when you go to high volume ciy events.
Speaker 4:Now that down payment is non-refundable. And I've always told my elders, whenever we go and I'm like, gosh, should I register for 60 for CIY this year If we have to scale back from that number, the conversation I always have with my elders is, yeah, this deposit's non-refundable, but if we don't get some of this money back, at least we know it's going to an amazing organization that we would support financially anyways. So that's kind of the way I've sold the non-refundable deposit to our elders is. Let's just look at this If we don't end up taking 60 people and we take 50 and we don't get that, let's just look at this as a way of financially supporting some brothers and sisters in Christ who are doing some amazing things that we want to get behind anyways.
Speaker 1:Well, that's super encouraging for me to hear. Obviously, so were you going to say something?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I was going to say, tommy, you mentioned earlier about students taking ownership and like, after the years you guys have been coming for a few years now from your church, do you, just off the top of your head, have stories when you think of students, whether preteen, middle school, high school, of ways maybe that they've been with their friends fundraising, like we talk about budgets and how you're able to maybe help students who can't go? But are there students in your community who've gone to these events who are like, hey, we're going to make this happen. Like, what are ways they've used their gifts, their talents and abilities that you've seen?
Speaker 4:I know that several of our students this year got that card this past year about raising money for 10 students to go to ciy.
Speaker 4:That's awesome and you're over in the corner, like yes, they're like I know, I know, off the top of my head, there was, there's, there's one uh young lady named uh Maddie that got a t-shirt. I don't even know what it looks like, I should go over to her living room and see it but she got a t-shirt press and so she made all the fields of faith shirts. No way, Um, and and she has in her mind that that is something that she's going to start doing. I'm making t-shirt, christian t-shirts to to raise uh funds for that way. But I will say it's kind of funny because we had fields of faith three, three weeks ago and we did it in the basketball arena and the house that Bird built.
Speaker 1:It was awesome. By the way, there's a statue right.
Speaker 4:We had like five students leading worship. I was up there just playing guitar. They were leading the singing. It was unbelievable. I mean it really was. I mean there was well over 150, 200 students there like just worshiping. I don't know, it was amazing. But there was like nine speakers, okay nine students that got up and at one point my friend, who happens to be the football coach that goes to our church. We're standing up top listening to all these testimonies about life change, about addictions that are falling away. Students are up there like literally confessing, like their parents are there and they're saying things. I'm like whoa, dude, you don't have to be that honest, but they are. They're like. I'm telling you like it was crazy, but the football coach leaned over to me during the event. He goes every time one of these students mentioned ciy to ciy pay you no.
Speaker 1:But it's crazy because yeah, I just want to be really clear for everyone listening that that is zero dollars.
Speaker 3:There's no NIL deals.
Speaker 4:There are no affiliate links, no affiliate links, but I think again, it's like I've got kids that don't even go to church, that are like elbowing me at basketball games and going I want to go to CIY and I'm like you don't even know what CIY is. Great.
Speaker 1:But they want to go yeah.
Speaker 4:And so, more than just fundraising, I think our students have taken ownership and saying this is their thing. Now, like it's no longer my thing. And now I'm kind of wrestling with like uh, okay, so that other pastor wants to go and like again, it's, it's okay. Like god, this is your thing this is not our thing and this is not. This is also not a tool that we're trying to use to grow our church. This is just, we know, an awesome tool for our students to feel that call to kingdom work.
Speaker 1:Uh, you know, because that's like for us, the super important piece is connecting that heart for kingdom work back to the mission of the church.
Speaker 4:So so I think COI considers it a huge win if, like local churches grow because of what they're experiencing at Superstart and it makes them move, which is just yeah, but it sounds really I think too, like I think probably the most important thing for me in our community is helping people find missional clarity for their own life. Yeah, and that's where I say sometimes I feel like I shoot myself in the foot because I'm constantly telling people that they should go out instead of recruiting people to help us out.
Speaker 3:You know what I?
Speaker 4:mean and I probably, you know like we joked around about being a staff of one, but you know I could probably do a better job, you know, in that area. But I will say too, it's not slowing down. I mean we have a. We have a fourth grade girl who actually snuck into superstar last year as a third grader, breaking the rules. Let's go.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:Cover your ears, Corey. No, I'm listening.
Speaker 4:She started a nonprofit that she's provided hundreds of people at nursing homes to receive electronic pets let's go, that's amazing and electronic birds and baby dolls, and because her grandma last year and her grant. Well, it started with her grandpa. Her grandpa passed away a little over a year ago and he was in a nursing home and she found out that these pets help fight against loneliness and an array of other things and she's like we can do this and they are in like I don't know like six nursing homes. And she's been on the local news in Louisville and I mean, and she started this whole thing called Evelyn's Blessings and that girl evangelizes in her school. Yeah, like, like crazy. And so that's what we have coming down the pipe.
Speaker 1:And so you know, for me I'm just like Is she going to be at Superstar with you this year?
Speaker 4:She will be at Superstar this year. Yeah, Make sure that I meet her, okay, yeah for sure Brad will be there.
Speaker 3:Yeah, for sure, that's so cool.
Speaker 4:So, you know, I think that for me and I think it also helps too, like I've never been in this season where I have two high schools well, middle school eighth grader and 10th grader in my own home, and I'm like, if they don't figure out how to make this faith their own before they leave this house, I'm a little worried, yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean yeah, totally.
Speaker 4:And so I think I'm in a season of my life where, being a single staff person, I can't I can't control everything, because there's only so many quote unquote programs that we can dream that you see, like, go make it happen. Like you know, I'll pray for you and I think our students have just caught that vibe and, and I don't know, it just kind of took off so cool and I really wondered is 60 enough? Like I? I see that I saw that Lee University is almost full and there's been several days in the last week where I'm like, do I need to go register 10 more people? Maybe I should just do that. Maybe I just go do that, because I, I fear I fear more of telling that student who wants to go that we're out of spots. Yeah, then I do, figuring out how to come up with a hundred dollars, right, yeah, right, but you, know, yeah, kind of.
Speaker 1:But also as you grow, I feel like that dollar amount that it costs to add a student becomes more and more so like are you? Well are you are you forking over a hundred dollars for every student that goes to move, or whatever is that?
Speaker 4:you mean like as a church, or you mean me, yeah.
Speaker 3:No, you Tom.
Speaker 1:Yeah, taking money out of that extra pillowcase.
Speaker 4:So we did a Google form here, trying to do a little better job, because one of the things I've been horrible at I mean October comes quick. By the way, it's really hard to sell family members about a July event in October, by the way.
Speaker 4:And I know CY knows this- and I know you don't have any control over it because you have to have numbers. You've got to know. I've always done probably a really poor job of that pre-registration yeah, this year we did a Google form registration yeah, this year we did a Google form and on it instead of in the past, I think whenever I've done things like this, I've just kind of put that thing out there, like, will you be requiring financial assistance? And this time I actually went into greater detail. I said will you need? Uh? I basically broke it up and said, hey, will you need 25% of your fee covered? I basically broke it up and said, hey, will you need 25% of your fee covered? Will you need 50%? Will you need 75% or will you need 100? Because we're actually charging students $500 a piece because, by the way, it's expensive. This is the first time last year we've ever had to get a charter bus.
Speaker 1:Yeah, those things are not cheap.
Speaker 4:If anybody knows like got the hookup on how that should not be like. Like it cost us 10 grand, just in travel costs, to bring kids to Lee University from French Lick and back yeah, and then we're at the event without transportation. We have a vehicle or two vehicles from sponsors, but that's really expensive. So we're actually charging students $500 a piece to go to CIY this year. But one of the huge blessings and I know this will be particularly relevant for people in Indiana and there might be organizations in other states but there's an organization called the Center for Congregations and we applied for and received a $25,000 matching grant to educate under the umbrella of congregational education. So, like, everything we spent the money on had to be in an effort to increasing biblical literacy within our congregation, and so all of our expenses, travel and all those registrations that we had to help out with as a church fell within that matching grant.
Speaker 3:So we had a $25,000.
Speaker 4:What's that? So we had a $25,000 assistance and we spent all $25,000 of that money and matched 2750 as a congregation to take our students to CY.
Speaker 1:So does the October registration thing like? To me it almost sounds like that would help with budgeting a little bit, because it's like you're getting a pre-registration from all of your students. They're telling you or their families are telling you, hey, I think we're going to need X amount of assistance, and then you're able to like budget for that for the following right calendar year it was less, it was, it was it.
Speaker 4:It provided more clarity, which really helped because, like right away and I, you know, I just had a qr code that I kind of let loose at the school and just had students start, you know, signing up and like telling us who their guardians are and you know phone numbers and that kind of thing and I think within the first week we had like 52 students that said they were going and of those 52, I think there were like six that needed full financial assistance, and so it was definitely very helpful because in my mind I was like, oh my gosh, are 25 of these students gonna need us to cover all right?
Speaker 1:yeah, cost for ciy and then I'm really bad at what would happen if they did. What if 25 people were like we need you to pay for for move? I think we would just take them, you just pay, pay for it and a lot of like running yeah I mean and I guess maybe that's the benefit of not being a super established.
Speaker 4:Like I said, we're not writing checks for a lot, and the impact that our faith community has seen from CIY has blown people's minds, so I think I have a blank check to write now as it pertains to summer camp at CIY would that be a conversation with your elders, like, hey, I need however much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, there's one elder in particular.
Speaker 4:Well, there's one elder in particular that handles our finances. And so I called him like two days before event registration and said hey, I'm about to commit to $90,000. Like, what do you think about that? You know, like it's not quite, it's not that. Well, we registered 90 people at $500 a pop, so $45,000.
Speaker 1:And have you registered for Superstar yet? We have not yet Come on. Hey, Fortunately that event doesn't fill up as quickly.
Speaker 4:Corey's right here.
Speaker 3:man, we got you know I'm right here, it's okay.
Speaker 4:I saw your posts.
Speaker 3:I saw your posts about it. I see you're excited. You can check out our Facebook page, bro. We posts about it. You can check out our Facebook page, bro, we just put out the event for Superstar.
Speaker 4:I've got some 5th grade teachers. My wife is an aide in the 5th grade classroom and our children's administrator, Jennifer Hill. She runs all of our children's programming on Sunday morning. She's crazy, Her daughter's on a volunteer basis. Wow, she is, she's crazy. So we, yeah, we always. We will have a big group at superstart this year.
Speaker 1:I love it. I love it so much. That was going somewhere and I can't really remember where it was. Oh, yeah, you're not like when you first register for Move Mix, though you're not on the hook for $500 a person.
Speaker 4:No, you're not, Is what I'm saying? No, you're not, no, you're not. But anyway, how does that?
Speaker 1:conversation go is what I'm trying to ask. Like, when you say I'm on the hook for this, is he like do no?
Speaker 4:no, it goes, it goes well, because I think, as a faith community like I just and I don't know if it's this way in all places, but around here it's like people are so surprised by students that want to be involved in their faith, like they're pleasantly surprised. Yeah, you know what I mean, and so it's a really. It's a really. But I'm also not that youth pastor that's constantly saying, hey, we'd like to buy five new flat screen TVs for our youth room. So I'm not competing and I know that's a real deal Like a youth pastor is budgeting for the whole year and camp is part of that budget, and so when we already asked for an upgrade to our youth room, that conversation hits a little differently for us. I think we're so lean and nimble that it's like, hey, this is something we do and it's just going to be something we continue to do and we'll figure it out.
Speaker 1:But there's a lesson in that and like being simple and having the flexibility to then invest in whatever those high priorities. Are that really truly kind of drive the mission of the ministry? That's encouraging, I don't know. Yeah, yeah, corey, this man has about six full-time jobs. Yeah, that's crazy, so I think I'm ready to let him go.
Speaker 3:That's crazy.
Speaker 1:Well, I was just going to say do you have anything?
Speaker 3:else. Well, I was just thinking, you know, as we're closing this out, man, a pleasure getting to hear from you and get to know your heart. But I talk to a lot of ministers who are children's and youth pastors. But yeah, you talked about six hats, brad man, like just briefly, can you just share like what it's like, as we close this out, to not only be ministering to children's and youth, but like to children and youth but to adults and to the whole body. Of course, that comes from God, who's instilled in your heart to do this. But, man, what do you love about your job and doing that? I just want to hear about that.
Speaker 4:So I probably preach 45 weeks out of the year. Yeah, sunday mornings. Uh, sunday Sunday I'm in a golf tournament. Yeah, daddy, daddy, daddy daddy, daddy daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy. I have a high school student, a senior, Graydon McGee. This will be the third time, and he's been a Christian for like seven months. This will be the third time he's filled the pulpit for me.
Speaker 3:Wow, that's really cool.
Speaker 4:And so last night he was sitting in my office and we're just like jiving over, you know office, and we're just like jiving over, you know, the sermon this Sunday is about man. If God is powerful, if God is all powerful, why wouldn't we ask him for what we need? And we were just like getting excited. And it's so crazy because, again, this is a, this is a very young individual, you know, a 17 year old I'm, and I look at him and like dude, are you, are you ready for this? He's like dude, I'm ready, I'm excited, you know, and it's like working with adults. Sometimes it's like man, you gotta like, really like, hey, you can do, this, you can do, and you have to baby them.
Speaker 1:What's that? You have to baby them, right? Yeah?
Speaker 4:sure you know. And so that's where I think I I get excited, thinking okay, something we're doing is working. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1:yeah, and also like god god is providing, like a, in a very unconventional way. He's providing support around you, um, where, like some youth pastors, have a staff around them to support them. Right, your support is coming from all these people in your faith community, including a.
Speaker 3:17 year old boy, not just youth leaders, but the youth themselves. Yeah.
Speaker 4:No, it is awesome. It is awesome. I love that man.
Speaker 1:Well, tom, it's been an absolute pleasure. Thanks for taking some time to hang out with us, and I just love your heart, man. I love it so much. It's a it's. It's really encouraging always for me to hear from you and just how different you're you're doing church than than so many places around the country, and, uh, you're rolling your eyes at me a little bit, but I mean there's.
Speaker 4:I was like I don't again. I still haven't figured it out. I don't know if it's good, it doesn't matter, never will. I haven't figured it out. I don't know if it's good, it doesn't matter, never will.
Speaker 1:Never will you put one foot in front of the other and it's like you only got to be faithful to whatever the next thing God calls you to is you know what I? Mean so um, I don't know.
Speaker 4:Well, you know, and I think too, I think it's really important to be faithful, Like one of the commitments that I've made in my mind is to be faithful to a place and a group of people, and in a small community like ours, that is so important, cause I don't know how many times I heard in the first few years that we were here like, well, you won't be here forever and I'm like dude, I'm not planning on going anywhere, like I'm, like I'm here, but it just, it just takes a while. Uh and, and you know, and just invest I I, by the way, ci, why you guys are incredible, like you really are, and I'm so pumped to go back to lee university this summer with aaron pelso, I'm so pumped to go to, oh yeah, oh yeah, dude, 1600 people in a 1500 room, you know like what?
Speaker 3:yeah, that's pretty and that was gross. Brad's excited to go back to lee as well. I am, I always, I love going to lee and we don't go to the same.
Speaker 4:Maybe there's some food upgrades on the horizon at lee university is what I wouldn't count on it here's the mentality that I've learned to adopt.
Speaker 1:If I could pick anything about a week of move to be your least favorite thing about the week, I'm picking food every time. I'm picking food every time. Because if food trumps the worship or the preaching and the thing I'm like. You know what, If everyone's least favorite thing is the food, that's great by my estimation. Now I have to eat that food for two weeks weeks, and that is certainly a bummer for me.
Speaker 4:So yeah, it didn't help the 90 taco bell bill that I got the first time, bro, you gotta go. That wasn't in the church budget.
Speaker 1:You gotta go to cookout. It's way cheaper. Oh, here we go. Yeah, yeah, all right, bro. Well, love you, appreciate you.
Speaker 3:Man, it was great. Appreciate it.
Speaker 4:Thanks guys, Appreciate you.
Speaker 1:Tom is one of the most authentic people that I know and I just love that conversation so much.
Speaker 3:It was great. I love the different stories he brought up, especially of people in the youth group where he talked about students who are fundraising, but also just hearing about the student who's also preaching like three times already it's here's the thing is tom has no like loyalty to tradition.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no I, I don't mean that in a bad way, I know what you mean.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like yeah, in a really really pure way.
Speaker 3:he he's just like yeah, we're going to do the things that God wants us to do, and it sounds really cool too that it's not just him but hearing the eldership and in the community of that church like yeah, like we see what God is doing through the church and we're going to we're and of course you see probably adult leaders also getting that, because they see what God is doing 100% and that's like when you don't have a mortgage and you don't have a huge staff bill.
Speaker 1:It's like, man, we want to spend money on this and the eldership says, yeah, that's super in line with our mission, so you can spend money on that. That's really cool. It's really cool. It's been a great conversation. Corey, I'm going to have you if you would close us out by praying our blessing over our listeners.
Speaker 3:I would love to. May God show you grace and bless you. May he make his face shine on you. May you experience the love of Christ, through whom God gives you fullness of life. May you be strengthened by his power, and may Christ himself make his home in your heart, that you would be full of his love and grace and that those you serve would see Jesus in you.
Speaker 1:Today's episode was produced by Michael Hester, lauren Bryan and me. Thank so much to Corey for being here and thank you also to Tom two people who I just love a lot and I'm glad we got to have this conversation today. We're going to be back in a couple of weeks to kind of wrap this series up on how to scale for growth. We're going to be talking to another really good friend of mine who I promise I'm not going to say is my favorite person of all time.
Speaker 1:I will not be saying that even though I might use different words and also say it in a different way. We'll see how it goes, but yeah, either way, it's going to be a fun conversation, so be sure to tune back in for that one. If you like what you heard, be sure to subscribe. Wherever you listen to podcasts, you can also subscribe on YouTube. If you want to watch, go ahead and and smash that subscribe button. Love you guys, see you next time. Peace, thank you.